acotar ships and their dynamics

Feysand:

Nessian:

Gwynriel:

Elucien:

It's a lot healthier to go for a daily walk than to sign up for a gym membership you won't be using because you hate that kind of exercise. It's a lot healthier to eat a frozen meal than to skip a meal because you were too tired to cook something healthy. It's a lot healthier to take a quick shower than to procrastinate an elaborate routine for days. Don't aim so high that you won't be hitting anything!

4 Books of Buildup is not something E/riels and E/riels alone get to claim. Yes, there have been moments in ACOMAF through SF that put the idea of E/riel into your head. Feyre thinking on how "handsome" they'd be together (literally the most shallow reason for someone pairing two people in existence but I digress), Az helping Feyre rescue Elain in ACOWAR, him offering Elain TT, Az sitting with Elain and listening to her talk about her seeds in ACOFAS, their "charged" look in SF and depending on the day and argument, whether the BC counts, their near kiss. In between every single one of those moments though, there is another for either Elain or Az or both. Elain was in love with Graysen in ACOMAF through ACOFAS. Az was still hung up on Mor, even in SF. He helped rescue Elain then went on to look at Mor with heat and yearning on Solstice. He gave Elain TT but only because Mor begged him to sit out of battle. He was relieved that he was not expected to get Elain a gift that first year. In all of those 4 books though, Elain and Lucien are confirmed mates. Confirmed by the King, by Feyre, by Rhys, by Az, by Mor, by Elain, by Graysen, by Lucien, by Eris. It is CANON that they are mates. The "4 books of E/riel moments" are canon too however it being love is heavily debated because neither Elain or Az have confirmed it to be that. There is NOTHING in canon that unequivocally states she wants a relationship with him, that she wishes he were her mate, that he is completely over Mor, that he would take Elain without a mating bond. In comparison, there is CANON showing Elain and Lucien are mates. Lucien calls her his mate, she makes sure Graysen knows Lucien's name when Graysen is referring to her mate, Lucien acknowledges the real thread between them and Elain confirms she felt it too. Could SJM decide to pull a fast one over on us in the next book and reveal the mating bond as fake? Sure, because she can do whatever she wants as the author however at this point in time, Elucien being mates is more canon than E/riel actually being in love. And to those who claim Elucien's bond will turn out to be fake, that the 4 books of proof of an Elucien mating bond can easily be undone in the next ACOTAR, then can't we say the exact same of E/riel? That the 4 books of "open to interpretation" interactions of E/riel could also easily be undone (I think they kind of already were in the BC but that's another discussion). If a storyline which was confirmed (once again) by Feyre, Rhys, Az, Cassian, Mor, the KoH, Eris, and the author herself in interviews can be magicked away after 4 books of Elain and Lucien's arcs being built around that narrative, that it could suddenly be proven as fake, then how is anyone arguing against how the unconfirmed love between E/riel (of which no characters are even aware of considering Nesta called Az Gwyn's new ribbon and Rhys told him to find a hooker instead) could be even more easily deconstructed? If it's that easy to undo a confirmed mating bond then anything hinting at Elain and Az is a house of cards in comparison.

MOR x AZRIEL FROM SJM PINTEREST

To all the Elriels who claim they've been set up for 4 books...

Tbh the problem with ship wars is that everyone tries to find a moral high ground to prove their ship is superior when actually shipping should be about making two characters kiss like a kid playing with barbie dolls

For E/riel to happen,

A lot of major changes to the story need to occur. E/riel theories are often convoluted and contradicting, but let's go over some of the things that need to happen, for these E/riel theories shall we?

Elain and Lucien's bond has to be 'wrong or corrupt' while everyone else's is perfectly fine.

Lucien and Azriel need to have a blood duel where Lucien dies.

The bond is fake and they'll both have a good laugh about it.

Elain will reject the bond, but will always still have her bond with Lucien. She'll just go with Azriel and he'll be totally ok with it.

BOTH Elain and Lucien will reject the bond, which...somehow it just what, goes away? They will both find love with someone who isn't their mate, Az/Vassa, but constantly feel the pull to eachother since the bond doesn't go away. Lucien will eventually be driven mad.

Lucien has to be a cheater. Being a mated male and his whole characteristic of being fiercely loyal? Out the window.

Jurien has to betray them or die, since Jassa is a contendor to Vassien. Jassa cannot happen so we must get rid of Jurien.

Gwyn has to be evil

Gwyn's a Lightsinger/luring Azriel, so him wanting to see her cannot be of his own volition or a draw to any mating bond, it's because he's under a spell.

Gwyn is going to betray Azriel

Gwyn and Elain are going to fight over Azriel, which Gwyn will reveal her evil ploy

Gwyn cannot exist past SF and will fade into obscurity

Someone is forcing Elain to be with Lucien, in which she and Azriel must sneak around with their forbidden desires before someone steps in and fights for their happiness.

Lucien just fades into obscurity or dies trying to protect Elain which she goes to Az anyway.

Elucien happens in the first book, but then Lucien turns into a sudden asshole and pushes Elain away where she realizes she loved Az all along? The second book is Elain and Azriel getting together...which would be all of 5 pages.

For Elucien to happen,

Elain and Lucien need to spend time together and get to know eachother.

For Gwynriel to happen,

Azriel and Gwyn spend time together.

Azriel stops focusing on his lack of a mate and listen to his shadows who are clearly telling him the woman he's looking for is right in front of him.

That's it.

For Elucien/Gwynriel to happen, all they have to do is spend more time together. We don't need anyone to lose their HEA, we don't need to kill off any characters, or make anyone suffer. Everyone gets a HEA, which in a romance novel that's about soulmates and love and healing and fantasy, that's what it's about. This isn't GoT/SOIAF where people need to be scheming and die.

What sounds more likely? 2 books left focusing on 2 different ships like Eluciend and Gwynriel? Seeing 4 people get their HEA and possibly some blooming side ships like Jassa and Mor/Emire? Or, 2 books, one focusing on Elriel, where one of the many horrible and depressing options happen, with the second book being someone else entirely, or Vassien? Which again, would be breaking characters.

You tell me.

You know something never mentioned with the whole "evil lightsinger" theory for Gwyn?

Catrin.

You know, her twin sister.

Would Catrin also not be a lightsinger if it's being based on their river nymph heritage? (They are, of course, separate species, but I digress.) So, that would mean that there aren't one but two lightsingers somehow conveniently avoiding detection despite lightsingers being described as killing for sport? As well as both of them living in the same temple with the same access to potential prey?

That's not counting the fact that presumably, Gwyn and Catrin's mother and grandmother are still alive. So, if they are lightsingers with the exact same nefarious description that we were told, then that means at any given point in time within the last 28 years, there may have been four lightsingers outside of the Bog of Oorid, and somehow no one knew about it?

Especially not even Azriel, with his entire spy network? Just because he couldn't leave Velaris while Rhys was UTM doesn't mean that Azriel's spies couldn't. If Azriel could determine that Koschei was whispering words on the wind to Briallyn, then feasibly, he'd be able to figure out that there were now four lightsingers outside of the Bog. Because they're, y'know, dangerous and mentioned as something to avoid in the Bog.

That definitely reads as something that would be a big deal. I mean, think back to how Lucien and Tamlin reacted back in TAR to the Bogge. It wasn't supposed to be in their lands, and Tamlin hunted it immediately because it was dangerous.

Wouldn't someone in the Autumn Court probably either eliminate Gwyn's grandmother, who would be a full-blooded lightsinger, or at least find a way to weaponize her? And again, something Azriel would likely know.

If we assume Gwyn's mother had her and Catrin at the same age as Gwyn, 28, that's 56 years between just the two of them minimum that lightsingers would be out of the Bog. Remember, Gwyn's mother couldn't stay in the forest house of Autumn or in the rivers of Spring, so she was born out of the Bog.

And that's not accounting for how long Gwyn's grandmother would be alive for and how much time she could've spent out of the Bog before finding Gwyn's grandfather.

Now, don't get me wrong, SJM isn't a perfect or incredible writer and does make mistakes.

But three generations of evil, bloodthirsty lightsingers somehow escaping the notice of all of Prythian? Let alone Azriel, who would probably be closely watching Spring and Autumn because of how both those Courts have harmed his family?

As well as somehow not noticing any signs of Gwyn's potential lightsinger nature while he trained her?

It seems like an awful lot to overlook, imo. So, if we want to believe everyone is still relatively good at their jobs and assume SJM has some of her writing shit together...maybe Gwyn isn't a lightsinger?

Maybe by nature of being 3/4 High Fae and 1/4 river nymph, she probably has magic that manifests in a way unique to her mixed heritage? Like how Rhys can magically hide his Illyrian wings?

Or maybe lightsingers just have the worst assumed of them, and it's not fully true. Like how humans assumed all fae were like the Naga and ate humans?

Either way, though, the possibility of Gwyn being evil seems pretty abmysmally low in my humble opinion. 🤷🏻‍♀️

TW:SA Gwynriel

This topic gets brought up every few months and while I don't expect it to stop anytime soon, even after the next book is released, I want to talk about it for a minute, specifically in relation to the most recent post that's circulating.

If you haven't seen it, the poster claims to be a 'licensed professional' and is giving their 'professional' opinion on SA trauma recovery in regards to ACOTAR ships. This person makes it very clear they are an e/riel, and as evidenced by their own comments on the post, found Gwyn to be 'sus' even after reading ACOSF multiple times....

For a moment, let's set aside a few points:

The fact that labeling an SA survivor (real or not) as evil or manipulative is very harmful to readers that are actual SA survivors

The fact that this never seems to get brought up in regards to Rhys, Lucien, or Nesta who were all canonically SA'd - only Gwyn

The fact that a 'professional' opinion given by a clearly biased party isn't very reliable

I find it galling that a supposed professional who claims to work 'extensively' with trauma survivors, couldn't comprehend why Gwyn would feel responsible for her sister's death, as if survivor's guilt is not a majorly common response to that sort of event

Let's focus on the main point, which is that this person seems to be insinuating that trauma responses and recovery are universal, even after specifically stating they don't think this is the case...

---

No one asked, or is owed it, but I'm going to talk about my own experience a little here, for context. You don't need the details, other than I'm a walking statistic. SA'd twice before the age of 25. The experiences were not particularly violent. One involved heavy doses of alcohol. Once was by a stranger, the other by someone I knew.

Now, I know the common belief is that people who experience sexual trauma usually develop an aversion to touch, specifically sexual touch, and by specific genders. This may be true for a lot of people, I certainly know women (and men) who this is true for. Some people, however, like me, are the opposite. I dissociated heavily from my experiences and had no aversion to touch or sex (one reason I related to Nesta so much).

I'm not saying this is a healthy coping mechanism- it absolutely is not. I was so desperate to prove I wasn't a victim, I actively harmed myself by putting myself in dangerous situations in seeking out intimacy because I (mistakenly) thought I was in control. It wasn't until I finally began seeing a therapist that I realized how harmful this was.

Even still, I never developed an aversion to touch or sex, I just became more mindful of my choices. Like many SA survivors, I turned to BDSM. When done properly (I'm looking at you 50 shades... 🙄) with people who actually know what they're doing, it can be very therapeutic for survivors of SA because it puts the control in your hands.

Again, I will spare you the details because you don't need them. That's not the point of sharing this. It's to point out- once again- that not everyone handles trauma the same.

The truth of the matter is, we don't actually know how Gwyn feels about any of this. Other than the little bit she tells Nesta and Emerie during the Blood Rite- which mostly amounted to 'my choice was taken from me in a violent way and I'm angry about it- she never speaks about her thoughts or feelings regarding that night, or men/sex in general, and we have not seen her POV.

The only men we know she's interacted with since that night are the bat boys. Other than her initial encounter with the Illyrians during the Blood Rite, she mostly keeps her distance from them and actually remains mostly level headed throughout the whole ordeal, even trying to sacrifice herself (knowing what will likely happen to her) to allow Nesta and Emerie to get away after she's shot at the bridge.

She's never really uncomfortable around Cassian or Azriel, maybe a little wary at first, but she warms to both in no time and is in fact a big reason why other priestesses eventual join. By the end she is quite comfortable with them both. Even with Rhys she just blushes (I know I've seen people try to use this as a 'gotcha' like she can't be into Az when she's attracted to his brother *groan* Rhys is hot, we know this, and personally, I think it's more celebrity shock like 'holy shit that's the High Lord of the Night Court' than a crush lol) And she wasn't all that bothered by having the men watch them while they did the Blood Rite qualifier, even after being warned. She literally shrugs it off.

She shows no discomfort when Emerie and Nesta discuss sex and even participates in the conversation which doesn't exactly scream to me that she'd uninterested in sex.

They like to point out that Gwyn went back to the library at the end of the book. This was her home for the last two years after her's had been desecrated (remember it wasn't just about what happened to her. Her sister and many of the people she knew in the temple were killed in front of her. There are several bad memories associated with it now, beyond her SA), and it's where she's been healing. It's perfectly reasonable she'd be wary about leaving, it's all she knows and she has no other home currently. Not to mention that she's said herself she doesn't want to stay in the library her whole life and she's already left it once. Granted, immediately after she left, she was thrown into yet another traumatic event so again, it's perfectly reasonable she'd be wary. It's unreasonable to think she'll never leave or that it will take a very long time before she's ready, she's already close to it, just needs a little more time to process what literally just happened to her.

Gwyn has also shown an interest in sex so it's not unreasonable to think she might try again in the near future. This is the sort of narrative we should be encouraging, that SA survivors are capable, and deserve to be able to move on and have normal, healthy lives. Not every SA survivor may want that but the vast majority do.

To say, as a professional, that an trauma survivor should be on any sort of timeline in terms of their recovery is irresponsible. It puts undue pressure on the survivor. They may take longer and feel something it wrong with them, or they may not feel they need as long and again, feel something is wrong with them.

It is irresponsible, as a professional to insinuate that trauma survivors should display specific traits or symptoms (such as anxiety or touch aversion) when everyone responds to trauma differently. Some develop severe disorders like anxiety and some function mostly normal aside from maybe the occasional episode. They may dissociate completely like I did.

Trying to put all survivors into the same box is a disservice to them all. Period. And we should not be using these sorts of opinions as basis for proving or disproving ships... let's be serious please and remember we're talking to real people about fictional people...

“our teeth and ambitions are bared” is a zeugma

and it’s a zeugma where one of the words is literal and one is metaphorical which is the BEST KIND

Something that's been circulating around all the shipwar drama is the fact that Cassian said that Elain didn't look good in the black dress, and I don't get why it gets so much traction, and heck even that it means she should leave her friends and family to go live in a court she's never been to?

Listen. I look bad in yellow. I know that, I avoid yellow because of that. But guess what? I live in a really sunny part of the world with palm trees and stuff. Does that mean that because I look bad in a sunny colour, I should just pack up and move to some place where the sun never shines? No. Obviously not.

Night Court has equal times of day and night, same with Day Court. It's literally just a colour. Chill.

There are a thousand arguments for each side of this shipwar but the opinion of one (1) man about a girl in one (1) dress does not automatically confirm any ship no matter what.

“Tell me when you knew,” (Lucien) demanded, his knee pressing into mine. “That Rhysand was your mate. Tell me when you stopped loving Tamlin and started loving him instead.” I chose not to answer. “Was it going on before you even left?” I whipped my head to him, even if I could barely make out his features in the dark. “I never touched Rhysand like that until months later.” “You kissed Under the Mountain.” “I had as little choice in that as I did in the dancing.” “And yet this is the male you now love.”

And yet this is the male you now love.

And yet this is the male you now love.

And yet this is the male you now love.

@starsreminisce posted these comments on their blog:

And the last paragraph really stood out to me. Something I've seen said by a certain side of the fandom is that a bonus chapter should not change the trajectory of what is in the actual book. I disagree with that because I look at the bonus chapters as a sneak peek of what's to come (with this particular bonus following the pattern talked about in a post yesterday, with the resolution to the small story pointing us in the direction of Gwynriel), things that Sarah will at a later point expound on within the series even if they weren't completely clear to us without them. But say that's the truth, say the bonus chapters are only in line with that which we already know (which isn't completely inaccurate because while the bonus hinted at Gwyn having a curiosity towards Az and him possibly having a bond with her, we do see bits of that in the actual book as well, there are scenes with her staring in his direction and scenes where he's staring in hers, where he shows admiration for her, where she's teasing him, where Nesta calls Az her new ribbon). One of the big arguments is that it's extremely clear that Elain has no interest in Lucien, that it's clearly been the case for multiple books. It's said Elain does not owe Lucien an explanation, that she does not owe him her time or attention. So why not write an Elain bonus chapter in SF where she and Lucien have a conversation discussing how they don't want to explore their bond? According to E/riels there's no need for it in the first place since she's made herself clear but they have also claimed that she won't break the bond until we have her POV. Then wouldn't a bonus in Elain's POV before her book be the perfect place for something that's so obvious so that when she starts her own book "with Az", there's nothing standing in their way and the focus can be on their romance and the plot and not the emotional toll that her severing her bond with Lucien would take? If the Elucien bond is as much of a non issue as some claim it be be, then why not deal with it in an Elain Bonus Chapter? When her book starts, Sarah could even recap the events of the bonus for those who had missed it. Elain thought back to that conversation she and Lucien shared shortly after Solstice. Where after Azriel's rejection, which had cut her deeply, she realized there was no place in her heart for anyone but Az even if she wasn't sure he still wanted her. That would have actually be a perfect way for SJM to move us past the Elucien bond with very little in the way of feeling devastated on Lucien's behalf, where his heart is not being broken in real time within her romantic arc. But the author didn't do that. She gave Az and FEYRE a POV. Feyre who already had 3 books and a novella and Elain with a total of 0. We know Az doesn't think Lucien is good enough for Elain but we don't know if Elain agrees with that. We know Az questioned the Cauldron because of his brothers and her sisters, that he hadn't thought of being with Elain beyond his sexual fantasies but we don't know where Elain stands on the whole "just wants one taste / why wasn't Az made my mate" debate. We know Az thought of Elain as too trusting and hopeful but we've no clue whether Elain was really thinking anything of the sort. We've got Feyre thinking back on how she made sure to keep her mouth shut on Elain not wearing Lucien's gloves, how had she put them on she would have never been pierced in the first place but we still don't know whether Elain's actions with the gloves actually line up with her thoughts. If Sarah wanted to continue on with what is apparently so evident in the four books of buildup for E/riel there was nothing preventing her from finally giving us Elain's POV in SF and having her tell Lucien that there's no reason for him to hold out hope any longer. The more likely explanation for why Elain wasn't given a bonus is because everything that E/riels and Az claim that is so very obvious regarding Elain's character might actually not be as obvious as they think.

If she's so happy in the NC, then why hide her thoughts? If she's so in love with Az, that it's clear as day, then why hide her thoughts? If she's so disinterested in Lucien, then why hide her thoughts? If we're supposed to believe that Elain's choice is Az, that there is no competition and that it should not be a mystery to anyone at this point, then why has she been so reticent to put us into Elain's head?

Showing Gwyn Love

Wanna know why I love Gwyn?

Gwyn saved the children at Sangravah, even though it led to a horrific act being brought upon herself.

Gwyn was the first to sign up for training. Showing bravery and strength which led to other priestesses eventually joining in.

Gwyn was the one who introduced and brought back the Valkyrie training. She is even the one who was first to cut the ribbon to become the 1st Valkryie again in a long time.

Gwyn sat up in a tree for two days watching the beasts movements and ended up leading them to the camp which in turn saved Nesta and Emerie.

Gwyn was going to stay back, despite what the men could/would have done to her, so that Nesta and Emerie would reach the top.

Gwyn has shown up for her friends and others in times of need, even if it meant something bad happens to her.

She is the very definition of brave, strong, and loyal.

🎨 mftfernandez

✨✨Friendly Reminder✨✨

Elain didn’t “consent” to Nesta changing her that’s why it didn’t happens. Gwyn didn’t “consent” to being with Azriel so I’m not shipping them. I’ve seen this being argued A LOT lately and I think I need to let everyone in on a little secret, are you ready for it?

BOOK CHARACTERS ARE FICTIONAL, THEY CAN’T CONSENT TO ANYTHING. Book characters are inanimate objects that have no agency. They have no REAL thoughts and opinions. They are puppets and Sarah Janet Maas is their puppeteer. They do and say what SHE wants. Did y’all miss the part in English class where fantasy is not reality and shouldn’t be treated as such? Did absolutely no one teach you to SEPARATE reality from fiction?

Artwork by Madschofield

Watch this whole video, it’s like two minutes explaining if Sarah changed her mind on Elucien or not, using her own words. 

Elucien's are attacked for thinking Elain will leave the NC for Spring / Day because she's is happy there. Because she's got purpose, friends, and her sisters. Because she declared she was part of the court.

But it's suddenly ok if she leaves to become High Lady of the Dusk Court?

Gwynriel isn't realistic because Trainer / Trainee relationships are inappropriate (aka forbidden in some situations though I guess they decided to forget about Feysand, Nessian, Rowaelin, how Chaol gave Yrene self defense lessons) .

Yet E/riel forbidden love is so romantic! 🤔

Gwynriels attacked for "romanticizing" Az's rescue of Gwyn from Sangravah in fanart.

Elriels regularly romanticizing Az's "dramatic" rescue (hiding in Feyre's shadow) of Elain during her kidnapping.

E/riels: "Elucien's bond is tainted because the Cauldron is tainted!"

Also Them: The Cauldron loves Elain!

They'll claim Lucien does the bare minimum for Elain because he's kept his distance since the novella.

While claiming Az loves Elain even though he admits to avoiding her.

They'll claim that because Lucien said he can't stand to be in the same room as Elain it's evidence he's not interested in her (despite him still staring at her with longing and disappointment a year later).

While claiming Az loves Elain.........because he can't stand being in the same room as her.

Hearing that Az didn't give Elain credit for killing the King because he knows she doesn't like the credit for violence.

While constantly using the hashtag Kingslayer

Gwynriels and Elucien's being bullied for commissioning non canon scenes.

While staring at all the art of Elain with a dagger tattoo, Az with a rose tattoo and them holding one another in a field of flowers while Az wears suspenders.

If Tamlin’s parents and Rhys’ parents were mates who were “wrong for each other”, why didn’t they reject their mating bonds? Would it be because the consequences would be too dire for both of their souls?

Even them being wrong for each other, they didn’t reject their mates, but Elain will reject Lucien just because?

Food for thought.