#please excuse me anon i'm just full of nie brother feelings all day every day lol | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

songofclarity · 3 years

Note

when you said "[Huaisang] took taking down jgy so seriously and so professionally; he has no cheering moment or hail of victory" I was reminded of another post I saw about the moment at the beginning of NMJ's Empathy flashback where the disciples are celebrating the victory over the puppets but NMJ only looks grim. It's something the Nie bros have in common: both consider violence and killing to be necessary and justified— but it's a grim duty, to be undertaken with seriousness, not satisfaction

Yes, that comparison is exactly it, Anon! I do appreciate how CQL ensured Nie MingJue was all business during his fights. Even at the banquet when the Sunshot Campaign was over and done with, his group arrived late (‘Sorry I’m late, I didn’t want to come’) and he looked miserable. Not even an official victory party could put a smile on his face, much less encourage him to celebrate three years of hard work!

I would hesitate, however, before accusing the Nie brothers of finding violence and/or killing as necessary. Those are just tools in the tool box and they could be taken out as needed but they weren’t always needed, much less required. We see time and time again how the Nie brothers pick non-violent options when violence and murder would make their lives so much easier. And this choice between violence and non-violence is important. This is the choice that separates them both from Jin GuangYao. Because when it comes down to it, what was the point of having fought against the Wen Sect if they were all just to become violent and murderous themselves?

For convenience, I have outlined Nie MingJue’s 5 year plan here:

Fight a war against a violent sect

Win even if it might cost him his own life

Go home and live in peace

Nie MingJue stayed his hand from murder not once, not twice, but three times when confronted directly with a cold-blooded murderer. He picked suffering Meng Yao/Jin GuangYao to live over easily justifiable back-alley execution. He banged on the doors of Koi Tower demanding Xue Yang be turned over to him, but never used violence to take matters into his own hands, not even when he held Baxia at Xue Yang’s throat and could have ended the discussion right then and there.

The only people Nie MingJue ever killed were nameless cultivators on the battlefield; nameless cultivators when he was being held prisoner in the Sun Palace; and Wen Xu, a declared enemy met on the battlefield. There is no evidence or accusations that he ever killed anyone after the Sunshot Campaign, not at the Burial Mounds and not when he had his qi deviation.

Nie HuaiSang, for his part, could have just stabbed Jin GuangYao in the chest when he was crying on him and be done with it. Violence is easy. Murder is easy.

For the Nie brothers, violence was never necessary, but justice was. And there is no justice if you just become the beast you fought to defeat, so rules and morals must be taken into account.

Nie MingJue decided, on his own, to send Meng Yao back to his father to face justice after the murder of the Jin disciple. Nie HuaiSang worked to expose Jin GuangYao’s crimes and let the world decide on their own whether or not Jin GuangYao’s crimes deserved punishment.

Nie MingJue followed the rules. He played fair. He asked for permission. He talked in private. He made his demands. He was aggressive, but he never killed to get his way. How easy it would have been if he killed to get his way like Jin GuangYao did! But he didn’t. Nie MingJue was good. Nie MingJue died.

Nie HuaiSang picked up where Nie MingJue left off. The letter to Qin Su was just a letter to Qin Su revealing some of Jin GuangYao’s crimes. Jin GuangYao got away with murdering the Jin disciple all those years ago, and now he’s going to get away with direct involvement in the murder of his own child? Or baby-trapping and then marrying his own sister? No, no he is not. And he’s absolutely not getting away with Nie MingJue’s murder or dismemberment.

Nie HuaiSang still never picked violence. He never picked murder. He never told people what to do or how to do it, and he certainly never held a weapon in his hand. That’s the beauty of his revenge.

As the saying goes: the pen is mightier than the sword. He picked letting the information speak for itself and giving other people the option to use violence, but that was never their only option. Sadly, no revenge plan, no matter one taken as seriously as this one, is foolproof when other people are involved. Qin Su and the letter were discovered by Jin GuangYao, who then blackmailed her, imprisoned her, and then pushed her to suicide. This shows the depth of Jin GuangYao’s cruelty. Jin GuangYao reacting in violence is a Jin GuangYao problem.

As another saying goes: do not shoot the messenger. We already saw how the Jin Sect protected and absolved Xue Yang of his well-documented mass murder. Nie HuaiSang would have heard about how Jin GuangYao, Jiang Cheng, and Lan XiChen were all OK with the Jin protecting Xue Yang while Nie MingJue and popular rogue cultivator Xiao XingChen were very much not. In order to make Jin GuangYao face justice, the one choice Nie HuaiSang never had was to stand up and speak out and expose Jin GuangYao’s crimes. Xiao XingChen tried that with Xue Yang and it got him a fate worse than death. Nie MingJue tried to stand up to the Jin Sect and it got him betrayed and his death to look like an unfortunate event, not even a murder. So instead, Nie HuaiSang got the information out there as secretly as possible and let everyone else decide on what to do with it.

And thankfully everyone agreed with him that Jin GuangYao was trash. No violence was needed to help them see the light. Jin GuangYao made his bed and now he has to sleep in it.

Violence is only a Nie brother final resort when justice is about to be evaded. Nie MingJue is so horrified after the Sun Palace that he’s willing to kill Meng Yao and then himself over the murder of his subordinates. Meng Yao uses the “I saved your life” get-out-of-jail free card, which not only threatens to hold Nie MingJue hostage to a life debt but also means at least two cultivators where killed to save Nie MingJue’s one life. That’s terrible math! Where is the justice in this?? But in case he is in the wrong, Nie MingJue agrees to kill himself too, so justice WILL be served one way or another before Meng Yao runs away again.

Violence and murder are indeed grim tools for a serious duty and they need to be handled respectfully and with resolve! Note how Nie HuaiSang at no point lies and says, “I had no choice.” It was his choice to send the letters, it was his choice to put himself in danger at the Second Burial Mounds Siege and at Guanyin Temple, and it was his choice to save Sisi from her unlawful imprisonment and let her speak on her own behalf. This boy had choices, choices other than violence and murder, and he never victimized himself by claiming otherwise. He never pleaded innocence or passed the blame. He simply dodged the discussion entirely, but the ending shows he knows what he did and why.

Nie HuaiSang, "Wei-xiong, why do you keep on asking me? No matter how much you ask, I don't know anything." With a pause, he continued, "But..." Slowly, Nie HuaiSang brushed together his storm-drenched hair. "I think that if this person hates Jin GuangYao so much, they'd probably be entirely merciless towards something he cherishes more than his life." (Ch. 109, ERS)

Nie HuaiSang has so much conviction that his cavalier attitude after Jin GuangYao's death is so cold that if anyone touched him they would probably be burned. When Nie HuaiSang lies, he says, “I don’t know.” He knows the importance of information and he’s not about to expose himself for having any that might get him killed. Nie HuaiSang’s fight was different than Nie MingJue’s in tone and shape, but Nie HuaiSang kept the same agenda and, frankly, played by the same rules as his Nie MingJue.

Some rules Nie MingJue lives by:

Outside input is important

Don't kill people for the rewards

Have conviction in your choices

Jin GuangYao was in the process of fleeing justice at Guanyin Temple just like he fled justice at Langya. Jin GuangYao laid a trap for Nie MIngJue at Langya and there was no doubt going to be a trap at Guanyin Temple--so Nie HuaiSang sprung one on him first.

“Brother XiChen, behind you!!!” (Ch. 108, ERS)

And the choice to stab Jin GuangYao was Lan XiChen’s, not Nie HuaiSang’s, although Nie HuaiSang was determined to see justice prevail and that treacherous Third Brother brought down.

Of interest, Nie HuaiSang’s ten year agenda:

Expose Jin GuangYao’s violent crimes

Win even if it might cost him his own life

Go home and live in peace

Violence and murder were never on the agenda. They aren’t necessary. They were never necessary. The tragedy is thinking that they might be, and that’s Jin GuangYao’s tragedy, not the Nie brothers. Nie MingJue’s behavior shows a man who thought if he fought hard enough, pushed hard enough, allowed redemption arcs to a murderer, tried to work with people who didn’t want to work with him, peace might find a way.

Violence was only needed because Jin GuangYao could not be stopped in any other way. He burned the brothel down with all the women inside it to hide his past and he tried to massacre the whole cultivation world to hide his crimes. Considering the amount of death the Nie brothers have faced, from family dead from qi deviations to piles of bodies on the battlefield to allies killed to save their lives, I dare say the Nie brothers had a respectful relationship with violence and murder because they wanted to escape the cycle the most.

#anon #asked from above #nie mingjue #nie huaisang #jgy vs nmj #nhs vs jgy #nie brothers #mdzs thoughts #there is absolutely NO reason this response needs to be this long #please excuse me anon i'm just full of nie brother feelings all day every day lol

369 notes · View notes