It’s baffling how Sakura or Hinata stans don’t realize they are treated the same by the narrative. They bash the other girl and are able to pick up all the unflattering moments and red flags, but when it comes to their favorite, it’s like all those basic observation skills just disappear into thin air.
I mean look at this:
Sakura hesitates, but decides to act on her selfish feelings (of needing to be on par with Naruto and Sasuke and to have them, especially Sasuke, look at her) and charges at the enemy despite not having a plan nor knowing about Madara’s true powers.
This act served no purpose other than to satisfy her own ego and to have Sasuke look at her.
No surprise, she gets immediately stabbed without making any damage to the enemy, and needs to be saved. Right after this scene, she is shown to be shooked by Madara’s powers while Naruto and Sasuke are fighting him. She had no idea what she was doing. She overrestimates her own abilities constantly.
She fails to be useful when it comes to doing damage to the enemy.
She is ignored by the object of her affection whose attention she desperately wanted. He wasn’t concerned for her at all, even Sakura realised it, and Kishimoto went out of his way to point this out.
I repeat, she was ignored by the guy whose attention she wanted and this was high lighted by Kishimoto.
Hinata hesitates for multiple pages, and is directly told that she would only cause Naruto trouble if she interfered, but decides to act on her selfish feelings (her need to confess her love to Naruto and to have him look at her) and charges at the enemy with no plan.
This act served no purpose other than to talk about her feelings and have her crush’s attention on her. She actually put the whole village and Naruto in danger.
She gets immediately one-paneled without making any damage to the enemy, and needs to be saved.
She fails to be useful when it comes to doing damage to the enemy.
She is ignored by the object of her affection whose attention she wanted. Naruto doesn’t even go talk to her, to him it’s enough she didn’t die.
I repeat, she was ignored by the guy whose attention she wanted, and this was high lighted by Kishimoto.
But the stans will not see any of this somehow. The similar patterns go right over their head. And this is not even the only similarity you can find in the text.
437 notes
·
View notes
Do you think sns is toxic? People use this excuse to dislike sns all the time to explain why nh and ss are 'underdeveloped but at least they are healthy (nh more than ss)'. I don't agree with nh and ss shippers about them being healthier than sns (them believing it just make me want to scrub my eyes with holy soap), but I admit that sns is toxic if one only stans the fanon versions of naruto and sasuke who says that either one dominate the other (not equal in skills and relationship).
I think that canon versions of sns are toxic only on the surface level. People forget that sasuke and naruto are ninja, resolving conflict with a deadly battle (vote 1 and vote 2) is not considered... too toxic? I mean at least they meaningfully communicate before, during, and after the battle unlike the majority of ninja in the naruto world. They show vulnerability to each other compared to Hashirama-Madara and Obito-Kakashi fights (Naruto crying in vote 1 before Sasuke puts a chidori arm through his chest) (Sasuke screaming in vote 2 as he punches Naruto, uncharacteristically with eyes closed). After vote 2 they work together (not counting the monstrosity of boruto etc) and seem to have a relationship (platonic or romantic doesn't matter it's still love) that isn't about hurting each other (mentally or otherwise).
I’ve never been under the illusion that sns’ relationship is 100% perfect. Like most relationships tend to be, they are flawed in certain ways.
The people I’ve seen say sns are toxic cite the following reasons: naruto wanting to beat sasuke into submission and making him come back to konoha (vote1 and vote2), to make sasuke forgive konoha by working for konoha and covering up the massacre, saying he’d die with sasuke at the bridge, etc. It’s based on the violent nature of their encounters and the shutting down of sasuke’s wants.
People don’t put it into context though. Naruto said both at vote1 and vote2 that he never wanted those fights. I’ve spoken about it in another posts, vote1 was to prevent a friend from going to orochimaru and making sure he was safe, and vote2 was showing sasuke there were other ways to achieve his goals rather than take on the pain of the whole world on his shoulders and be alone for all eternity because that would cause sasuke pain. Idk why it’s so hard for ppl to understand this.
Naruto’s first instinct was to tell everyone about the massacre before even confirming it. Kakashi was the one who stopped him. Then at the bridge naruto didn’t even need confirmation. He just said he understood sasuke’s actions. The choice to not tell anyone about the massacre - isn’t it common sense that naruto would eventually leave that choice up to sasuke given these reasons? If sasuke wanted ppl to find out, he would, and naruto would NOT say ‘no don’t’. kakashi would tho.
Naruto saying he’d die at the bridge with sasuke - while… romantic… it was not the best way to go about things. But sasuke said he was going to destroy konoha then. Naruto didn’t want sasuke to destroy konoha. So naruto was like: 'okay. though first, take out your anger on me. But just so you know, if we do fight… we’ll die.'
The intent behind SNS ‘toxic moments’ are founded on love for each other and the context of the times that they live in. They care for one another so much. They resort to violence because they're ninja after all, and they speak heart to heart through their fists. “I knew it was going to take more than just words to understand you.” "When 2 high level shinobi exchange blows they can read each other's hearts."
So, while SNS' relationship had elements to it that can be considered toxic, they ended up working through those. You know... their reconciliation.
Ss and nh are in a completely different ballgame.
Pink girl just chases after sasuke cuz he’s a prize to her. What is ‘healthy’ about a girl that chases after a guy, after the guy told her ‘no’ so many times, a girl who doesn’t try to understand the guy and just resolves to kill him cuz oh no he’s evil :’( pink girl only talking about HER feelings, both at the beginning and end of the manga. She never bothered to understand sasuke. “I can’t trade blows with you” read between the lines: 'I cannot read your heart.’ They were never meant to understand each other. “I have no reason to love her and for her to love me.” What is healthy about a relationship where the guy doesn't even see the girl for like 10 years... not because he can't but because he doesn't want to.
Lady h… I can’t even be bothered with her tbh. she admired naruto from afar but it’s moot if she never did anything about it. Naruto always maintained it was iruka and sasuke for him. what did lady h do? girl confessed in the middle of the battlefield only to get one-shotted by big boss pain in front of everyone and after the arc naruto just ignored her and was like ‘ANW SASUKE’ LOL.
My point is, they’re one-sided. How are one-sided relationships healthy? And while sns did have their toxic moments, how come ppl misinterpret where they stemmed from, how they were eventually resolved, how Kishimoto took great care in showing that sns' feelings were reciprocated while the others weren't, when sns still have the strongest bond even post-naruto?
Sns are not perfect. but they're not toxic. and ss and nh aren't healthier either.
128 notes
·
View notes
THEORY 3 NH: NARUTO IS A CURSED BIRD
Continuation from this ask
Note: this is all sort of headcanon/theories. (Don't take it too seriously)
Main question: “Could I, as a SNS-fan make sense out of NH/SS?”
NARUTO BECAME A CURSED BIRD
And is put in a cage despite him preaching (rightfully so) about freedom during his fight with Neji.
Majority of the NH-shippers and Hinata-fans, both are pretty proud of the ‘Hyuuga’-name for some reason and prance around gushing over its status within the walls of Konoha more than anything. Perhaps it’s because there literally is nothing else to Hinata other than her “princess”-status (+ now “wife of Hokage”) and the title itself is supposed to be something positive, except they forget how uninterested she is in changing things for the better until this very day despite witnessing what she has. Especially when it comes to her beloved “Neji nii-san” which dying body she ignored in favor to obsess over a strong and big hand that awkwardly held her own instead.
We can understand why she was a little distracted, yes? /s
For this theory Neji had to die.
Don’t get me wrong, I hated it. It is one of the most unnecessary scenes in Manga/anime, but if this is somewhat close to what Kishimoto was thinking then I can understand why he did it. (Doesn't mean I agree 👀)
Maybe he was so incredibly petty about having to change his own story/ending that he not just completely assassinated Hinata, Neji and the entire Hyuuga clan’s development arc’s, but as a way of defying the whole “oh, I have to even fight my own staff in order to get Naruto to transform into naked boys?” (he did), “I can’t decide my own ending anymore?” (he couldn't), “We need them to be in these hetero marriages?” He threw the whole ‘destiny’ talk which Naruto successfully convinced Neji's perspective over, back into his face. Not in spite of Naruto the character, but towards the ending of the show.
‘Destiny’.
(I talked about this before, but I don’t see Kishimoto as a victim in this case. I’m pretty sure that in some way he himself was involved. However after talking to people in the industry I also know that despite Kishimoto being well-respected for his craft, within such companies there are many people “above” him in “power” that he felt pressured by and if you read his interviews it is something he mentions a lot: pressure. I think we shouldn’t underestimate that. Especially for a creator, something you work on for years and years and years and put so much love and devotion in.. to say “he only sold it away for money” seems ridiculous to me. The characters are his, but there is little say he has within the franchise itself unfortunately. We don’t know for sure.)
Anyway- look at Naruto’s face when he learns about the main/branch-house situation within the Hyuuga clan:
Lee then tells Naruto that the branch house feels “slighted”, because “rules are established to protect the blood and house of the original Hyuuga family to put them in an advantageous situation.”
Now Naruto here is still a kid and relates much more with Hinata and Lee since they’re being called ‘losers’ which is something he can’t stand since he says this to Neji later:
Therefore, when Neji calls Hinata a loser, Naruto instantly takes her side, growing a dislike for Neji without understanding where Neji’s own hostility comes from.
Until he himself fights Neji. Which is beautiful, because it’s one of those moments where Naruto learns to understand another person. (Note: understanding and feeling empathy doesn’t mean agreeing with their actions.) And we learn that Neji’s character arc is one where he will free himself from his cage.. eventually, right? The Hyuuga Clan will change its ways, yeah...?
“Talent is decided at your birth.. you could say that everything is decided when a person is born.”
“Why the hell do you always automatically decide things like that!!?”
“Then.. are you saying anyone can become Hokage through hard work?”
Neji continues to tell (more like, provoke) Naruto that his “destiny is already laid out for him as is his own” and therefore Naruto can’t become Hokage no matter how much he trains, but we can already see little cracks in this theory, (let alone the people surrounding him, like Lee for example), because I don’t know about you, but even if he is a prodigy and an absolute genius.. there is still a reason Hiashi was so surprised to know he was even able to fight like he did. Neji definitely, despite his natural talent, has worked hard.
And through very, very, very, very hard work, Naruto did become Hokage.
Neji was wrong. Many destiny/faith elements within the Naruto-verse proved this theory to be wrong.
Except..
Let’s take another look.
“Heh.. is it painful? Stay on your knees before a power you cannot change and realize your worthlessness. Having your dreams come through hard work.. is an illusion.”
...
“Stay on your knees before a power you cannot change...”
Familiar?
Naruto was so desperate to change a situation out of his control that it caused him to beg on his knees before “power” larger than himself on behalf of Sasuke. No amount of ‘hard work’ could help him which led to him having a panic attack at the thought of Sasuke being targeted.
But we know Naruto 🧡:
“I told you.. I’m not good at giving up..!”
And he never gave up on Sasuke either, he was the only one to never have given up on Sasuke.
And despite what Neji tries to tell Naruto about his own experiences, as horrible as they are when it comes to his position within the Hyuuga clan, Naruto refuses to give in since he believes that hard work is what made Lee stronger, that Hinata is trying her best and that he himself will become Hokage regardless of what Neji says.
Naruto and Neji seem like they’re completely opposites, one is called a prodigy, the other a loser, one believes in destiny, the other in hard work, but they really aren’t that different:
Which is also another reason why Naruto fights hard. Becoming Hokage means more to him than just that as we know, but it isn’t something he can explain to Neji during this battle. The odds are stacked against Naruto even more than Neji would think.
Not only does Naruto prove Neji wrong during this fight alone, he ends up becoming Hokage and said he “would change the Hyuuga” when he does. 👀
Now.. Neji, NH’s cupid..
This is what Neji said after recalling a memory of his father:
“People are born burdened with a destiny they cannot oppose.”
(“Neji you must live... “)
Yet even his father enforces the idea of “main/branch”-family. (“I wish I could have born you into the main family..”)
The most common argument I’ve read on NH-essays is that Neji’s father decided on his own to die and so the choice itself is “freedom” from the ‘cursed seal’ and his destiny as he said himself here:
Therefore, Neji’s death, which is him “choosing” to die for Hinata, is also “freedom”.
I call bullshit.
(There are whole arguments about Neji’s father doing it for other reason’s too, but I’m not too familiar with the Hyuuga family in general apart from Neji, nor interested- so I’ll stick to this only)
Even if that is what Neji’s father truly thought, Neji himself, even after learning the truth has learned with the help of others what “freedom” can feel like or what it can mean. That freedom is something you can choose for yourself.. which especially doesn’t have to mean he has to sacrifice himself for “Hinata-sama”. In fact, that would be the absolute worst thing he could’ve done.
“But that is what he wanted.”
No. That is the opposite of his, Hinata’s and the Hyuuga clan’s development arc’s. That is Kishimoto mocking it and making a joke out of the situation- you can’t read it any other way.
Why?
Because Naruto, our highly emotional intelligent boy, although not full grasping the severity of the clan’s dynamics at this point of time yet(?), called him out on it early on in the show:
“You're the same!! The branch family is suppose to protect the main family, yet doing that to Hinata... In truth, you are trying your hardest to disobey destiny.”
Naruto is saying that the very fact that Neji is treating Hinata the way he is already, that he is holding grudges and putting his disapproval on display is him already disobeying his destiny. Neji is already unknowingly fighting his destiny just like Naruto.
Although in different situations and for different reasons, they’re still similar when it comes to “being cursed”. Naruto knows it all too well..
Neji starts seeing Naruto as ‘a free bird’ despite previously calling him a loser. His theory starts having cracks left and right and on top of that Genma adds:
“Heh.. even a captured bird.. if it’s clever enough, will try to open the cage with its beak. Never giving up its desire to freely fly in the sky.”
“This time you’ve lost.”
But he doesn’t just mean the battle. (Same when Sasuke said it, there is a lot more weight to it.)
Here, Genma refers to his arguments about destiny.
This time. Meaning, there should come a time where Neji will "win". Where Neji will be free- really free.
Neji never intended to give up his life for Hinata. (I don’t know why people say Neji gave up his life for Naruto. I know that Naruto says that himself, which also makes it sound like he never acknowledged Hinata trying to protect him, lol, but if Neji let it be, Hinata would’ve died instead.. so..)
His character arc was supposed to be one where he chose “freedom” in a way that was different from his father. “Freedom”, a choice, all for himself that had nothing to do with the Hyuuga clan, or was in some way in opposition to the main/branch family dynamic.
Neji at first: “Destiny cannot be changed.”
His thoughts with a few cracks: “Father.. is a person’s destiny a thing like a cloud flowing with an inescapable flow..? Or can a person choose the flow he wishes.. I still don’t know the answer to this. Either way, the destination may be the same in the end.”
And then: “However by choosing to live like the latter (choosing a flow they wish for themselves), a person can live and strive towards a goal. And in this match (with Naruto) I have finally understood that those who have that are truly strong.” (Naruto is an example)
“And father I have but one goal.. I want to become stronger.. enough to not lose to anyone.. that’s how I feel now.. Father.. the birds are flying freely today. They look so happy.”
Naruto looks happy.. Naruto looks free, I want to be free.
Neji wants to be truly free.
But not like this.
For one, Naruto wouldn’t have died without Neji sacrificing himself, this was to protect the main branch, so again this kills the entire development arcs.
Secondly, I love Neji, but he says the reason why he did so is because Hinata is willing to die for Naruto (which Naruto ignores) and also, because Naruto called him “a genius”.
So listen, the whole reason we have ‘Boruto’ the show and why all our characters are mutilated to their very core is, because of this little panel here:
Which, Naruto, I want you to take it back, because they’re in the middle of a war and they need all the power they can and Neji definitely holds that power. Not Hinata. This wasn't particularly a genius move.
Surely, he wouldn’t throw away his life just because he’s thinking of some silly one-sided romance only because Naruto gave him a little compliment a few panels ago and “Hinata-sama” is willing to die for him so all of a sudden he decides to say “fuck it and fuck character development, I was right about my destiny I’ll die for the main branch and make it seem it’s for Naruto who has shown zero interest in Hinata-sama whoo~”
????
Why do you think Kishimoto didn’t let Naruto finish his sentence here? I’ve seen people say that it is because Naruto is suggesting that he should’ve “reserved his death for a Hyuuga” since he died for him instead. But that doesn’t make sense!!!!!!!!! First, why the hell would Naruto say that?! This is Naruto!! Why would Naruto EVER suggest something like that? Having fought Neji, understanding how Neji felt, sharing a “cursed fate” and “fighting destiny” only for him to basically giving up on the freedom he so intensely craved... What Naruto is showing here isn’t just grief, it’s confused shock. Secondly.. he DID die for Hinata, not for Naruto!
Despite the reason not loving her, why do you think.. Naruto STILL ignored Hinata after all this.
That’s not a question btw.
Also, the reason why Neji says “because I was called a genius” is because he recalls Naruto saying:
But the question to that was:
“Why do you go against your destiny so much?”
“Because you told me that I’m a failure...!”
Meaning: Naruto lives to defy that destiny in a way.
So Naruto asking Neji: “Why are you willing to throw away that life (for me)?” In other words: “Why are you willing to accept your destiny?” (Dying for Hinata/main-house.)
And Neji replying: “Because you said I’m a genius.” Is Kishimoto shitting on NH in the most ironic way possible. (Kishimoto is called a genius many times. And he is, but this is ironic.)
Because if ‘Bolt’ (Boruto) is what “screws” (holds) Naruto and Hinata together and that is the reason? Then that is pure clownery at its finest. It’s the most laughable and fucked up thing that has happened to this show.
Naruto has to accept that in the end one of his two goals which was none other than ‘Sasuke’ and his love for him (and vice versa) always would stay "so close and yet so far" and it resulted in four characters looking miserable as hell.
In comes their adult lives where Naruto oddly seems to have adapted a way of life that seems similar to that of a caged bird. One that resembles not necessarily holding grudges, (well, he’s not really smiling in the Hyuuga photo’s huh..), but surely regret. A bird that has to say in words how he, “as Hokage, sees the entire village as family as the previous generations like the third often have said so”..
And as he surely protects that family with all he has..
Kishimoto makes it clear where his heart truly lies and it doesn’t seem to be anywhere near the “main” family. Considering none of those issues are solved or are in the process of being solved. Knowing Naruto’s true character.. he can’t be okay with it at all.
To Sasuke:
So in my theory then.. if they love to claim the Hyuuga clan is so powerful blablabla then take responsibility. Apparently, not even the Hokage can do shit about it. Naruto absolutely would’ve. What’s miss princess doing apart from serving tea and watching drama’s?
Naruto locks himself up in his Hokage office despite not having to. He doesn’t go home for a meal even though it is nearby and he knows his kids get mad at him if he doesn’t. He knows his Chakra is low and yet sends a clone to his own daughters birthday that he forgot until his son reminded him with the risk that it would disappear anyway.
Yet he seems to regain some of that energy back and wants to go out whenever Sasuke is around. He smiles and wants to go on missions together with him and seemingly meets up to go to restaurants. He “becomes a free bird” around Sasuke. And in Neji’s words.. “free birds look happy.”
They aren’t tied to that destiny. Naruto and Sasuke always fought to defy their own destinies.
"If we really take it to the end then we won't be Uchiha/jinchuriki."
But there is that heteronormative destiny that was expected from them and the franchise that is an automatic choice for such a continuation. Especially in that genre.
It was a mistake to do so.
Naruto may have become Hokage and I love him, but to me it looks like being tied to the “main” Hyuuga is just a curse, lol.
Perhaps Kishimoto felt like a slave to the industry and it’s norms at the time for not being able to go with the ending he envisioned for the story and spoke of already in interviews way back, because despite whatever he thought of, in the end Naruto’s destiny was already planned for him because of heteronormative standards.
And maybe he felt that Naruto couldn’t change that by fighting. Not now anyway.
Who knows.
62 notes
·
View notes