Tumpik
#yeah no self cest people
the-mcu-is-amazing · a year ago
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MCU fans: okay so it would be nice if Loki had some self love ya know, he’s been through enough
Marvel: okay so we’ll create room for a ship between themself and a very different but still a version of themself.
MCU fans: …
MCU fans: wait a minute…
In this household we stan Lokius and love a SIBLING LIKE dynamic between Loki and Sylvie
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sun-wukongs-peaches · 6 months ago
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Can I ask why you don't like shadow//peach? (Censored just in case!). Like, is it just cause you view them as brothers?
Also I think I read somewhere that in the journey to the west, they were confirmed not to be brothers?? I was wondering if you could tell me more about it if you know.
Sorry if this comes off as badly worded, I'm just genuinely curious and dont know how to properly ask without sounding like a bitch
Sun Wukong and Liu Er Mihou are identical - despite LEMH having a different (though Very similar) look to the Monkey King in lmk.
During jtt/w, SWK strikes Six-Ears and is left for dead and in response, Tathagata Buddha says something roughly along the lines of " Sun Wukong destroying that toxic/horribly angry part of himself", and after doing so, SWK was alivieted and more at peace with himself. Thus Six-Ears is widely viewed as being created from Sun Wukong, having literally been manifested from his own negative emotions.
LEMH is Literally a copy of SWK. Having the same DNA as each other, that would make them related, hence people using the term brothers a lot. They may not be "brothers" exactly, before anyone starts trying to argue against that, but they ARE biologically relative to one another. Just in the fucked up way. So in a sense, shipping them together is more of a self-cest situation, which honestly is just as irking and gross.
So yeah. Not a fan.
[Edit: Antidotefortheawkward-art and taopunk made some in-depth posts regarding the ship and the characters' relationship here, both being worth the read, (x), (x)]
This is also something I've been wanting to talk about for SO LONG that strongly links with this so buckle in.
In lmk, it has massively hinted towards the original telling of their relationship, what with Sun Wukong having thrived fighting alongside and being friends with Liu Er Mihou before the pilgrimage (from what we've been told by LEMH - which honestly shouldn't be seen as solid evidence of what their relationship was like, with it being one side of the story and being influenced by his obsessive need to hate him).
Their relationship can heavily be associated with someone who is oblivious to the toxic traits that they have, or being comfortable in the poor mental state that they're in (that being a common case for ppl with various mental disorders (i.e. depression, anxiety, etc.)), and in this case, Six-Ears is still That Part of him. Who, eventually, Sun Wukong let's go to move on with his pilgrimage, as he feels himself getting better not having those toxic parts of him around. Despite this, as Six-Ears being SWK's "figurative" obsessive anger, he keeps coming back. Almost as if it was SWK's own negative mental state still clinging onto him - which he is trying So Hard to keep away to this day, because why would he want to feel that way again, or act that way again after his enlightenment?
I think in canon it's going to portray the situation as "letting go of a toxic friend", but I have a strong feeling it goes A Lot deeper than that js
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just-antithings · 11 months ago
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... I remember when making jokes about fucking your own clone was popular in fandom circles, so when did ppl start to label self-cest as problematic?
It's just some good ole self-love.
yeah it’s annoying how moralizing people have become
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mssirey · a year ago
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Kinktober 5: Body(hair) worship
This got a little away from the kink and more towards gender feels, but so it goes. Enjoy!
There came a day.
Realization snuck up on Zed, quiet in its approach, a whisper of recognition in the stillness of the morning as he sipped his favored brew. Sweetness sat on his tongue, and he savored the warmth that bled through his chest, lingered with it as it mingled with the bloom of euphoria.
It happened in the matter of a blink—one moment it wasn’t on his mind and the next his head cocked to ponder. It was gentle, caressing his heart with a delicate touch, lifting until he was breathless.
The beauty was in the absence of weight, the lack of that itch of worry. There was a time when he would have picked at every detail, would have thrown himself into every effort to police himself. There were countless days when he couldn’t remove other people—their perception and their judgment—from the way he saw himself, and it had soured his image.
There were scars on his body, dug into his flesh by his own clawing, but it had been some time since his reflection showed them. They faded with the care he’d learned to take, and one day he’d forgotten to look for them.
It was freeing.
He had spent so much time curled inward to hide his chest, but oh how good it felt to breathe until his lungs were full and his chest open. He had muted his own joy by burdening himself with fussing and rules, his attention split between the life he lived and the picture he painted, but his body was his.
Rather than dissecting the parts of himself that brought up that gnawing ache, Zed chose to celebrate.
“Hey,” he breathed against the back of Lena’s neck as she dried her face one evening, her hair up in a towel.
Their gazes met in the bathroom mirror and Lena smiled with a softness that made Zed’s heart all fluttery. “Hello, my love,” she sighed back into him.
“Can I show you something,” he asked, his chin locking over her shoulder as he wrapped his arms around her waist.
“That depends,” Lena chuckled, turning to kiss his cheek, inviting warmth to meet her lips. “There’s not much I can see like this.”
Zed rolled his eyes, but his grin never faltered. “My thighs have gotten hairy,” he couldn’t help the giggle that bubbled up as he stepped back. He had often stamped down his excitement over little things, the differences that were so unworthy of note without that personal importance, but he liked sharing them with Lena.
“Well, let me see,” she beckoned. “Come on, drop your pants.”
Zed quickly undid his fly and pushed his pants down to his ankles. His boxer briefs conformed to his body, hugging close, and there were pronounced tufts of hair that spilled out at the edges.
“Oh! It’s very distinct,” she breathed.
“Right? There’s so much!” Without much thought, Zed ran his fingers through the coat of thigh fuzz, his delight filling him. “And it’s so soft.”
“Can I touch?”
Zed’s gaze snapped up, his mind taking a moment longer to process. “Oh, yeah, sure.”
With his hand out of the way, Lena reached between his legs and ran her fingers up the inside of his thigh. “It is soft,” she agreed, chasing a shiver up his body. “And so thick.”
Zed kept himself still while Lena continued to tease her fingers through his hair, caught between the giddiness that she encouraged and the deafening thunder that rolled through his head.
“You like it?”
The deep rumble in Zed’s chest was unconscious, but it brought their gazes together, a curious lift to Lena’s brow as heat rose in his cheeks.
“Yeah, I like it,” he answered.
Zed caught the barest flicker of amusement behind Lena’s eyes, but she kissed him with only sweetness. “Me too.”
Hearing Lena say she liked it—just as she had with most things Zed shared—was magical for his confidence, but Lena didn’t stop there.
Zed hooked his finger in behind the knot of his tie as they closed the apartment door on the night they had spent at a LCorp gala, ready to loosen it from around his neck, when Lena’s hand caught his.
“Let me.”
Zed blinked as his hand lowered and he made no other effort to undress. His jacket was pushed from his shoulders and guided down his arms before being folded neatly over the back of a chair. When Lena returned, she took hold of his tie and tugged. Every step back she took, he followed, their eyes locked together, until he stood in front of his favorite armchair.
Zed’s tie went slack as Lena neared, the fabric slipping through her fingers until she reached up to free him, deftly pulling it loose and letting it fall. She moved to the buttons of his shirt and he didn’t stop her, his thoughts little more than a noisy buzz in his head.
And the further down she got, the lower Zed’s mind sank into the roar of his blood in his veins. Lena was measured, her hands steady and unfaltering, but her heart thudded heavily and her cheeks were touched with color and he could only marvel.
The pull at the back of Zed’s waist and the feeding of the tongue of his belt through its buckle had him enraptured, swimming through the haze of something intoxicating. His pants went down easily and his boxer briefs followed after, and Lena helped him out of everything.
And then Lena was on her knees, right between Zed’s feet, her lips on his stomach. Her kiss was open-mouthed, but it wasn’t sloppy in the way she got when she was desperate, slowly following the trail of hair down from his navel.
At his pelvis, Lena pushed and Zed sat, spread his legs to make room. Her mouth skirted his crotch and instead she sucked at the inside of his thigh, settling into him, one palm flattening against his stomach.
Lena’s touch was often tender, but her lips seemed to leave a prayer on his skin, the reverence of it sparking deeper. He covered the hand on his stomach with one of his own and then teased his fingers into her hair, petting her in a silent expression of the gratitude he couldn’t find words for.
When calm settled over them, Lena’s head turned and she nuzzled her cheek into Zed’s thigh, sighing blissfully. They stayed there like that, together finding peace.
Lena consistently found ways to feed the love Zed had for himself. Her gestures weren’t always loud, but they struck a chord in him, made him want to sing and fill the quiet that left room for him.
Previous pieces: Self-cest, Size, Kryptonian Furniture, and Choking!
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frenchbreads-writing · 6 months ago
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You Don’t Have To Be Lonely When I’m Here — [Mirage | Elliott Witt]
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I wrote this as a completely self indulgent fic for myself for one of my own personal fav ships of Mirage which is him with his Decoy
I also posted this on AO3 the link is in my pinned
I hope you enjoy!
Pairing: Elliott Witt x Elliott Witt, Elliott Witt x Decoy
Words: 2.1k (2,183)
Warning(s): Nudity, self-cest (no nsfw)
Requests: Closed
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Loneliness.
For a long time that’s all Elliott had known.
Between losing his siblings and his mother's condition he’s had to do a lot by himself.
Joining the games allowed him to meet many new people that he now considered a part of his family.
Like Wraith, who’s warmed up to him more after he helped her find out more about her past, or Rampart who became like a sister to him, and even though he might not show it Elliott cares for Crypto as well even with all of their banter. As well as most of the legends he has at least a decent relationship with. Well besides Caustic and revenant.
And he’s thankful for them, they helped ease the feeling of loneliness.
But even though he now has some of the closest friends he’s had in a long time there was always something missing.
He was surrounded by adoring fans and close friends yet he couldn’t shake the hollow feeling in his chest.
Elliott loves his friends and he loves his fans, but he, like any other person, craved intimacy. He wanted someone to hold, someone to come home to at the end of a long day at the bar or from the games. Someone who waits for him and holds him when the days get tough. Someone who cares for him as much as he cares for them.
He had tried for so long to find someone either from dating apps or by going out and meeting someone on a night out on the town but none of his previous relationships ever stuck around for longer than a few months before breaking it off.
He didn’t know where he went wrong, he tried everything in his power to please the other person. But yeah maybe his shifts at the bar did run a little late and his schedule was a bit hectic due to the games, and his concern for his mother’s condition would always be at the forefront of his mind but he really did try in his relationships.
It was safe to say Elliott was desperate but he was still hopeful that one day he’ll find the one.
And tonight he had brought someone home the night before. Was it someone from a dating site or was it just a bystander in the bar he went to last night? Was it a woman? A man? The alcohol he had ingested made the memories fuzzy. But one thing he knew for certain was that they hit it off. He had a great time talking with them. They were easy to talk to and they had fun that night drinking and partying together. Enough for Elliott to invite them back to his place.
It was late and they had stumbled through the door, all drunken giggles and sloppy kisses. And one thing led to another and they ended up together in his bed, their bodies moving together in a dance of pleasure heightened by the buzz of the alcohol in their systems.
Maybe it was the alcohol, or maybe even just the high of having someone in his bed but he was sure that this could be the start of something with this person.
Elliott hated the morning after drinking.
Especially because of the splitting headache or the cottonmouth that accompanied waking up.
The space next to him in bed was vacant and cold; its occupant had long since left while he slept.
Elliott is naked, laying on his side, vacantly staring at the wall, his chest heavy.
He’d been like this ever since he had woken up to find yet again like every other time in the past his bed devoid of a warm body next to his.
He probably should’ve been used to this by now it’s happened way too many times to count.
Meeting someone at the bar, having one too many drinks, taking them home, and then waking up the next morning alone.
It’s basically a routine at this point but Elliott still gets his hopes up every time.
A weight behind him caused the bed to dip and the blanket was raised before suddenly a warm equally naked body was pressed up against his back.
The person softly settled their hand upon his waist and rubbed circles with their thumb as they pressed soothing kisses along the side of Elliott's neck.
The familiar sensation of facial hair rubbing against his neck gave away who it was.
Craning his neck, Elliott turned to see his decoy’s brown eyes staring back at him.
“Hey, there handsome.”
Elliott just stared at him before sighing and turning away facing the wall again.
His decoy frowned before wrapping his arm around Elliott's waist and pulling him closer against his body.
A moment of silence passed before Elliott shifted around until his face was pressed into his copy’s chest.
The clone immediately tangled his fingers in Elliott’s hair and cradled him as he hugged the decoy’s midsection.
Elliott took a deep breath, taking in the musk and the leftover lingering sweat and cologne that his clone managed to replicate.
It was soothing, having his own scent surrounding him, having his clone run his hands through his hair, and lightly scratching at his scalp.
“Wanna talk about it?”
Elliott scoffed.
“What’s there to talk about? I’m just a loser who can’t get a date and who’ll probably be alone forever.”
His decoy waited a moment to see if he would continue and when he didn't he pulled back and looked into Elliot’s eyes.
“You’re not a loser I mean c’mon look at us we’re the most handsome and coolest legend in the Outlands!”
Elliott avoided his gaze, looking down and picking at a loose thread on the blanket.
“I’m not that cool, I mean Wraith can open portals and do that teleporting thing and Dr. Somers has a black hole in her backpack.”
He pushed his face back into his copy’s chest muffling his voice.
“And I’m not that good looking. I mean Fuse is right there.”
The clone suddenly pulled away from Elliott, sat up, and looked him in his eyes.
“Hey, stop being so hard on yourself because even if you don’t think so I think you’re the most amazing and handsome man I know.”
Elliott pushed himself up to better face his clone, his cheeks heating up.
“You really think so?”
The decoy gave him a smile and patted Elliott’s shoulder.
”Yeah, I do. I mean look at me, are you gonna tell me that I’m not good-looking?”
The trickster could only smile lightheartedly and shake his head.
“I thought so.”
The both of them slid into a companionable silence, the tension fading away.
Elliott's eyes wander from his decoy's eyes to admire himself.
He never really sat down to admire the way his holo-tech accurately replicated his features.
Elliott wouldn’t necessarily call himself vain but with his clone’s reassurance, he couldn’t deny that he was a handsome man.
His eyes wandered to the scars that adorned his decoy’s face mirroring exactly where they were on his own.
Elliott raised his hand to stroke a scar on the apple of his clone’s cheek with his thumb.
The decoy immediately leaned into his touch nuzzling his face into his creator's skin.
His clone reached up to caress the back of Elliott’s hand, turning his head to place soft kisses to his wrist.
Elliott’s gaze drifted from his clone’s face down to his lips and swallowed hard.
The feeling of his decoy’s lips pressing kisses on his skin sent small jolts of electricity through his body and he wondered what his lips would feel on his own.
It can’t be that weird right? It’s basically like making out with your reflection in the mirror or even your hand when you're a teenager. Which is much more embarrassing than kissing a physical copy of yourself.
Fuck it.
“H-hey.”
His decoy stopped kissing Elliott’s wrist and looked at him.
“I was w-wondering if uh- can I- um can I kiss you?”
Elliott didn’t know how he expected his decoy to react to his question.
Maybe a strange look or he laughs at him, or perhaps the decoy would fizzle himself out.
“Nothing’s stopping you.”
Elliott froze, pulling his hand away from his cheek, shock written all over his face.
“Really?”
The decoy chuckled at his creator's expression and shrugged.
“I mean, it’s just a kiss, nothing wrong with that is there?”
Elliott cleared his throat.
“I-I uh guess n-not.”
His decoy shrugged.
“Then I guess it’s settled. c’mere.”
The decoy shifted, pushing the blanket off his lap exposing his naked body to rest on his knees facing Elliott beckoning him to come closer. Said man hastily listened and mirrored his clone's actions, sitting equally exposed to him.
Now they were face to face, sitting completely naked.
A shiver ran down Elliott’s spine from being exposed to the chilly morning air. But the cool air did nothing to quell the burning embarrassment as he faced his clone.
Was he really about to kiss his decoy? While being naked?
Maybe he should back out and shut his holotech off and forget this ever happened.
Maybe—
“Hey, look at me.” His decoy gently cupped Elliott’s face in a soft but firm hold. “Don’t be so nervous. I’ve got you.”
Elliott felt the embarrassment eating away at him even more.
“A-are you sure this is okay? Isn’t it weird that I want to uh k-kiss myself?”
The decoy shrugged.
“It’s only weird if you make it weird.”
The decoy moved to let go of Elliott's face.
“But if you’re uncomfortable and you don’t want to, we don't—“ “W-wait!”
Elliott grabbed onto the decoy’s hands before he could pull away and placed them back onto his face.
“I-I’m sorry but-but I want this. I want to do it. I want to kiss you.”
His decoy looked at him surprised at his outburst, blush spreading along his face, before chuckling.
“Alright then. Do it.”
Elliott bit his lip and let go of his decoy’s hands, shuffling forward on his knees, reaching out, and placing his hands on his bare waist.
The feeling of warm flesh both shocked and delighted him. He’s touched his decoys before but never like this. Never has it ever been so… sensual.
Elliott swallowed the lump in his throat, gaze shifting from his copy’s lips to his eyes.
“A-are you sure?”
The decoy smiled and gave him a quick nod.
Elliott took a deep breath and leaned in, closing his eyes, and pressing his lips softly, almost timidly, against his decoy’s.
The first thought in Elliott’s head was that his lips are surprisingly soft. He took care of himself outside of the games of course but being out fighting in a blood sport for hours on end usually left his lips a bit chapped. But the feeling of his lips as rough as they were was nothing like any of the previous people he’s kissed; this was different.
This was himself. The feeling of his slightly cracked lips against his own.
It just feels so right.
Elliott sighed into the kiss, shoulders gradually relaxing as he wrapped his arms tightly around his waist and pulled his decoy closer until their bare chests were flush against one another.
His decoy’s tongue poked through his lips and swiped over his bottom lip. Elliott softly moaned, wasting no time parting his lips to welcome the tongue that entered his mouth.
The decoy tangled his hands in Elliott’s hair as he explored his mouth, gently massaging his scalp as he softly worked their tongues together.
Elliott’s head was spinning and he didn’t know if it was from lack of oxygen or from the overwhelming sensuality of this moment.
But from the feeling of his clone's mouth working in tandem with his own to the hands in his hair, he wouldn’t have cared if he had died because as far as he was concerned he was in heaven.
Though his clone could go on forever Elliott was still human and needed to breathe so eventually they had to part.
Elliott gently pulled away, breaking the kiss and pressing their foreheads together.
The only sound in the room now was that of their labored breaths as they held each other as close as possible, hands holding on tight as though if they let go this moment would fade away.
Elliott opened his eyes and admired his clone’s face. Even though it was an exact replica of himself Elliott couldn’t help but think that his decoy was the most beautiful person he’s met.
It was an exact copy of his own red face and though he didn’t need to breathe as Elliott did. The decoy was panting seemingly as out of breath as he was.
His decoy didn’t have to do this. He didn’t have to comfort Elliott and make him feel so good, so… important.
No one had ever made him feel this way before.
Suddenly as he stares at his clone he realizes that he doesn’t feel so alone anymore.
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shadow-turtle-234 · 6 months ago
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Reminder to all parties (Lokius, S*lkis)...
YALL ARE HYPOCRITES.
Yes: both Mobius and Sylvie abused Loki during the series. And yes, biphobia and transphobia has increased in this fandom (because of this shit show). However, none of y'all are innocent.
Many S*lkis love to harp on the "wah, you biphobic misogynist! You are mad your gay ship isn't canon!" excuse on Twitter and on here, but in you all are silencing those are female and/or female presenting and/or trans women (who may or may not be bi), as well as other bi folk who found more issues with S*lki. Such as the pro-Autogynephilia messaging Disney/Marvel been pushing (there is literally no way to dance around it, it is autogynephilia. Please stop lying to yourselves - KH, SDM, MW and EM have all revealed their true colors when it comes down to trans people and their views on them. Sophia has blocked trans folk [idk if these people are for either ship] on Twitter who called her out on her transphobia and/or critiquing her and/or her character; and Kate has been outright ignoring and playing innocent to her fucking audience members) by forcing Loki with a female version of himself who is a massive sociopathic bitch, and the actual biphobia is how so many people (either Lokius or S*lki or none) called Loki's sexuality as nothing more than him being frisky til he fell in "true love" with Sylvie (yes, I have seen these horseshit takes. And it needs to stop) and the fact Kate herself said she wasn't going to continue exploring that element of Loki's identity (then again, she never did. Stop praising her for literally doing fuck all), and the incest issue as well as the IPV that Sylvie performs on Loki makes Amber Heard look like a fucking saint.
And, before anyone gets pissy, Mobius is just as bad. Being Waldy's self insert, of course (much like how Sylvie was Katie's), he treats Loki like shit and threatens him with death and tortures him repeatedly throughout the series. However, I myself still enjoy the natural and authentic chemistry between Wilson and Hiddleston, and for me, that makes this ship a little more enjoyable than the former. But, I know just how toxic the Lokius fandom is on Twitter (I mean, Twitter in general is a toxic cest pool owned by Elon Musk now. Are we really surprised?) and they need to learn just to block and ignoring and to not engage in sending threats. If you are by any chance a Lokius shipper who has/planned to send threats - piss off into Hell, rn.
Hell - BOTH parties need to realize that they need to learn just to block and ignore. NOT SEND THREATS (Or you can piss off into hell). This is the problem that both parties are guilty of: sending threats and/or KYS messages to anyone regardless of their shipping stance; hell, even valid criticisms about the show and people who've made them- yeah, they've gotten threats as well. I have seen a few mutals of mine repeatedly be sent death threat after death threat, for posting their opinions ON THEIR BLOG. And it needs to stop.
Also, do not send me death threats for the tags or for the fact that I made this post. Y'all never cared for tagging appropriately (yes - both parties). And the tags aren't for positive only posts.
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pitch-pearl-void · a year ago
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(The borderlands anon from however long ago)
So, I finished watching the show a couple days ago, because there were a couple things that showed up consistently in fics i that I didn’t understand (blood blossoms, some of the baddies, a handful of fenton inventions, etc)
First off, I still very much prefer pitch pearl to amethyst ocean or whatever the hell it’s called
And also, do you know where pitch pearl as a ship came from? I know there’s the episode with fun and super, but is that all there really was? Or were there more early fandom headcannons that supported them as separate beings?
Hello again! Sorry this took so long, I wasn’t sure how to answer 😅
Canon did a poor job with AO. I would even say it did it dirty, but it's popular enough it doesn't need that kind of support lol. If you really want to give it a fair shake I’d recommend reading fanfiction for it, but I understand everyone’s preferences are different. I personally don’t ship it because shipping best friends is something I have real issues with, but it’s not a bad ship if you want something that’s soft and makes you feel all warm inside.
Onto pitch pearl tho!
Tbh, I’m not entirely sure myself how pitch pearl as a ship started. I don’t believe it was because of the Fun and Super episode, largely because those two are rarely used in the ship. 
I asked someone else, and they thought that moment in What You Want when Phantom was first torn from Fenton as this colorless ghost might have been what started the concept they weren’t one whole person. Because, honestly? This ship goes far, FAR back. A lot of the older fics made Phantom into a voice in Danny’s head or a spirit that could separate from him at will without the need of the Ghost Catcher in order to offer Danny comfort. They had no rules because there weren’t any set way yet. The fact that Phantom could move and think independently from Danny was enough to get people thinking. It wasn't all romantic, most of it was borderline at best. They mostly focused on hurt/comfort and self-love, finding a balance between human and ghost with the occasional kiss thrown in.
Then there’s TUE, where Danny meets his evil future self and learns that his ghost half killed his human half after merging with Plasmius. It definitely gave more credence to the idea there might be more to Danny’s ghost half than simply having ghost powers. It aired before Identity Crisis, so it set the stage with a BOOM and had a much bigger impact on the ship. Phantom being seen as his own person is a bit more credible when he’s willing to kill Danny. It helped that TUE was a VERY popular episode. It drew in a huge crowd, and everyone was curious about what made the ghost half snap like that if he’s supposed to be Danny.
Supporting that idea is that a lot of the older art and fics took a darker view of Phantom in general, seeing him as Danny’s darker half or a ghost out for revenge after being imprisoned for so long. Even the name “pitch pearl” was created with that in mind. I always thought of it as “white hair/black hair” in the same vein as AO taking inspiration from Sam’s purple eyes and Danny’s blue, but when I went searching for the origins for the name, the old explanation set Danny Fenton as white pearl and Phantom as pitch black. The reasoning for that was partly their jumpsuits pre- and post- accident, but also because Fenton is human and “pure” while Phantom is a ghost and dangerous--because without Fenton, Phantom became Dan and destroyed everything.
For obvious and somewhat personal reasons, I don’t subscribe to that. But it does make all the art where Phantom looks evil while holding Danny make sense. I don’t like dark romance, and I’m personally thrilled we moved away from such a dark beginning, but it likely had a hand in the early popularity of pitch pearl.
If I were to guess how else it started when the source has them as one person, I would say it was most likely the fanart? Putting Fenton and Phantom side-by-side has a yin-yang appeal, and when they interact in art, you get the sense that these are two characters, not one. This was really popular when the fandom was much bigger than it is now.
For instance
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Save Our Soul by nycken isn't a shipping piece by any means, but it could very easily give rise to the idea, especially if someone is new to the fandom.
They did not shy away from it being a self-cest ship back then, though. The idea that Phantom wasn't Danny was there, but I don't think anyone looked for evidence in the show to support it. That seems to be something the ship has evolved into rather than something it started from, and it is honestly my favorite way to see it.
I do have many headcanons about how they aren’t the same person in canon if you're interested! There’s the out of sync transformations, the title sequence and how Super and Fun are shown to separate in the Identity Crisis episode, Vlad’s inability to clone Danny, the way Danny talks to himself, just all kinds of things! If you want to hear more about those I'd be happy to answer 😁 (they'd probably be easier too lol)
But yeah, I think it was TUE and fanart. There may have been other factors (I think this was around the time Yu-Gi-Oh and puzzleshipping was popular too) because fandom doesn't exist in a vacuum, but I really couldn't say for sure. It's a ship that means different things for everyone who ships it. I like the psychological questions when they start off as "one" (the bonded peeps version) and enjoy the aus like soooo much, but others like it only for aus, and others like it as a crack ship, and then there are even others who like it as something dangerous. Some people love it for Fun and Super in Identity Crisis because they're just fun caricatures. It's hard to find the origin point when it has so many branches lol
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charliewrites99 · a year ago
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I love how people be like: "Self-cest doesn't exist in the real world, so we can't say if it's wrong or not."
Yeah guess what, neither does the TVA, or Shield or Thanos.
Yet we still debate and write esseys about if Thanos was right or wrong. And no one ever says that in the REAL WORLD 50% of people can't just disapear.
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firelxdykatara · a year ago
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Your reaction to Sylki means a lot to me. Its my first ‘problematic’ ship and all these people telling me I support incest are not helping me feel less ashamed and revolted by the perverse intrusive thoughts I deal with because of mental illness... plus I think Sylki is supposed to be immoral and slightly unsettling...this is LOKI we’re talking about. Ya know, the horse fucking narcissist. The damaged supervillain...
Honestly the fact that you, who hasn’t even watched the show yet have a more reasonable reaction to selfcest (an already established Loki trope) than half the fandom really shows just how much the fans woobify Loki. He’s not some innocent baby boy that must be protected from all the darkness in the world...he’s Loki. The god who indirectly caused the apocalypse in the myths?
Plus I feel like they’re missing the whole point here? The whole show is about identity and self acceptance? It’s just wrong and surreal enough to fit the tone of the story? It’s well written and really in character? It might mean a lot to people with severe self esteem/self loathing problems...
I couldn’t care less if it’s endgame, I even don’t think it should be...but all this hate is making me so conflicted and frustrated.
Sorry if that was long...just needed someone to vent to.
Honestly, like, I have been stunned by the vitriolic reactions to sylki in this fandom lmfao. As if Loki isn't particularly infamous in comics canon for fucking a stallion and giving birth to a horse (and he also fucked a giantess and she gave birth to a fucking wolf and a huge-ass snake, Loki's family tree is something else lmfao), and yet people think it's somehow weird that he'd be attracted to and entertain the idea of a relationship with someone who is only 'him' insofar as she technically fills the Loki-shaped hole in another version of reality?
Come the fuck on lmfao.
I get that a lot of the vitriol is coming from the biphobic idea that 'if this canonically bi character, who expressed his queerness on screen in words' (no I haven't watched the show but I did watch that clip and I'm not interested in giving Disney or Marvel asspats but I will still take my rep where I can fucking get it) 'proceeds to become involved with a character the audience perceives as a woman, it's queerbaiting and he isn't Really Bi', but I also cannot express adequately with mere words how much rage that instills in me lmfao. A bi man in a relationship with a woman is every bit as bisexual as a bi man who is single or a bi man in a relationship with a man or with someone of any other gender. He is still fucking bi regardless of his relationship status. And the idea that this on-screen confirmation of his attraction to multiple genders just doesn't count unless he's making out with a dude pisses me off to no end.
Sorry for that tangent, but yeah, I absolutely agree with you. At the end of the day, Loki falling in love with 'himself' (although it seems to me like it's been fairly well established that Loki variants aren't really him in anything but name because they've all led very different lives, or at least Sylvie has, although again this is just what I've gotten from tangential fandom osmosis and scrolling through the tags a bit out of curiosity) as an act of self-love and acceptance could be a really powerful piece of storytelling, and I think the people screaming about how 'it's basically incest' don't understand a) what incest is and why it's actually harmful (and why it literally cannot apply to self-cest no matter how you twist it lmao), and b) Loki as a character.
Anyway, keep stanning Sylki--endgame or not, canon romance arc or not, it looks like they have a really rich&interesting dynamic to explore and I hope the show doesn't shy away from that just bc some people are idiots.
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the-mcu-is-amazing · a year ago
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Lokius shippers and Loki fans in general, any last theories/headcanons/fics before the new episode?
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gottanerdout · a year ago
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Well...
there's gonna be at LEAST two very distinct camps after this episode, I'm calling it now.
1. the people calling Loki/Sylvie basically incest (self..cest?)
2. the people that are like, "yeah, actually, him falling in love with another version of himself seems about right."
and honestly, I couldn't imagine any other character show causing this kind of faction chaos, so at least it's on brand?
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recipe-for-thomathy · a year ago
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Aight so I figured out why the Sylki ship makes me uncomfortable even though the concept shouldn't be new to me, seeing as I'm in the TSS fandom.
It's the fact that Loki and Sylvie are LITERALLY the same person in a CANON universe.
Meanwhile in the TSSverse, everyone is either imaginary (the Sides) or is a character only PLAYED by Thomas.
The key difference is that these characters can be seen and interpreted however we like because we have the creative liberty to do so.
We're able to SEPARATE the character from their role (specifically, the Sides), give them a new look, race, own personality, etc. and reimagine them as a whole different person from Thomas.
In Loki, however, Loki and Sylvie are not fictional (in their universe, at least). They're the SAME people but from different timelines.
THAT'S more self-cest (to me) than shipping together two imaginary Sides of a person.
Basically, what I'm trying to get at, is that these characters can be seen as MORE than just Thomas playing dress-up.
So yeah, thanks for coming to my ZenTalk ✨
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stackthedeck · 6 months ago
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i told my friends today after lying about it for some days and their reactions was like:
friend 1: holy shit, but thats fine we are in the same "level" i read more and worse so ok
friend 2: i am not actually disappointed, i dont expect nothing good coming from you but you should go to rehab THATS HOW ADDICTION STARTS!!! (they were like you guys are so dirt and it is worrying and aa)
i also told them why the name of the fanfic is "stuck together" and they were like "i didnt i didnt- why?? why?? cringe"
they said is cringe but they also said that cringe is what makes me special so yeah
the fact that they EXPECTED THAT I WAS READING THAT is sad like i told them to make a guess about the character and in the first guess they got it
also i told friend 1 (who is a daredevil comic fan) that you wrote matt/daredevil and they were like: 😟😐🤨
obsessed with this anon thank you so much for the updates!! I love showing my friends weird fanfic just to cause chaos in the group chat. I live by the "if I have to see it, so do you" mentality and it's caused endless entertainment.
Also in defense of my daredevil fic, I'm not actually shipping Matt with himself. It's in-universe rpf, not self-cest, Matt is reacting to people in his universe shipping Daredevil with him, said people being unaware that they are the same person. Because the secret identity x the alter ego is the funnies concept to me, it's my favorite miscommunication in superhero fiction
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The "you can't hate self-cest, because it literally doesn't exist" comeback I've seen is bizarre. What does that mean, exactly? That if something is fictional then people can't dislike it or find it uncomfortable? What?
It's dumb as hell, yeah. You can hate whatever you want, it's not like you need their permission. I will never understand their willingness to decide for other fans what they can and cannot feel or think, but from what I've seen a lot of those who try to police other people's opinions have convinced themselves they're superior to them based solely on the fact that they think liking something is morally superior to disliking it.
But whatever you interpret from a piece of media is perfectly valid and if they want their love for the series to be respected they have to respect those of us who didn't like it. It goes both ways.
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syccphant · a year ago
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Hi, I’m bunny (he/him) 💖🐰
DNI: under 18, minor in your country, a trans feti/shist, transmed/truscum, a general bigot, if you support tru/mp 👌🏽
Beyond that I ask that if the kink isn’t listed on my “yes” list, then don’t tag my posts as such! Thank you 🥰
I’m not gonna block you for having different kinks then me, but I ask that you respect and follow ykinmkato/dldr rules on this blog. Yeah, going way back to 2012 here lol 😂 basically, I won’t force my kink on you, and you don’t force yours on me and we’ll be okay ❤️🥰
Navigation:
Bunny body = My photos. Do not reblog.
Bunny feelings = anything I make thats not inherently nsft but that I don’t post elsewhere because reasons lmao
Bunny bonk = my explicitly sexual posts. (Not photos.)
Bunny blogs = reblogs / text post
Bunny dream = reblog / photo post
Lucky rabbit foot = wishlist
And here’s my kink list! (This is obviously subject to change)
Yes-Yes
✨ cnc / soft r*pe play (depending)
💖 exhibition
✨voyeur
💖 somno
✨ calling someone “master”/“daddy” (just as a title tho, because ~power dynamics~)
💖 bruises / hickies / marking
✨ age gaps (I like people older than me 🙈, 10+ years is ideal, but any age gap is good)
💖 self identifying pillow prince
✨ soft bdsm (collars, biting, ropes, etc, etc)
💖 impregnating / breeding / cumming inside
Maybes
💫 hair pulling
💫 degradation
💫 alcohol
💫 role play (Slave/Master, Steps, in/cest, etc are fine but only in role play scenes )
💫 monster fucking (I’m iffy)
No-nos
❄️ choking
❄️ knife stuff
❄️ do not misgender me. Or else.
❄️ body fluids (spit and cum are fine. Everything else is no)
❄️ smoking
❄️ pet play
❄️ vore
Things to know about me:
🐰 you can call me Bunny
🐰 he/him & 21+
🐰 I’m Bisexual && polyam
🐰 I identify as a trans demiboy
🐰 I’m only really online on fridays & saturdays, the rare times I am online.
🐰 I’m in a relationship of 2 years. My gf knows of this blog and supports me. 🥰 I’m poly, she’s not. She’s the ultimate wingman.
🐰 I made this blog for the sole purpose of uhhhhh attention. I crave more than any one person could ever hope to give me.
🐰 Please gimme attention 😔
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maccreadysimp · a year ago
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breaking down this anti-ian article bc it bothers me ( from the child of a bipolar mother and a male teen with same sex attraction ) while also providing valid reasons ian sucks ( from someone who likes ian )
ive had this drafted for a while so i dont think i cover anything from season 11
tw for i^cest and r^pe
he was with a married man
in this point it points out that he was with kash and he continued his relationship with kash even after linda put cameras in the store
“Ian didn't seem to care about how wrong his affair with Kash was or how much it could hurt Kash's wife Linda, whom he saw at the store regularly. “
that is a quote from that part.
ian gallagher was fifteen in season one, kash was an older man who bought him gifts and payed attention to ian ,, that was not on ian , none of that was ian fault because he was a child
ian wasnt open with lip
“ Ian didn't tell Lip about his preferences and forced Lip to figure it out on his own. Lip was instantly accepting of his brother's truth and even offered to help him figure out any confusion he might be harboring, so it's really strange that Ian wasn't just upfront with his closest confidant from the start.”
no , lip wasnt forced to figure it out on his own and he also wasn’t instantly accepting.
in this point it mentions that ‘they’re extremely close ( bestfriends and brothers ) so its strange ian didnt tell him’
like point 1 , ian is a fifteen year old boy, growing up on the southside , and thoughout the show it has mentioned multiple times that the southside isnt that accepting
back to lip -- lip wasnt accepting, sure he was fine but ‘helping your younger brother figure it out’ by having a (female) classmate give him a blowjob isnt helping
he secretly dated his best friends brother
“Most friends have an unspoken rule about not dating each other's siblings, but Ian broke this rule by secretly entering into a relationship with Mandy's closeted brother Mickey.”
the only thing i have to say about this is , he was still with kash and mickey was a boy in his age group who was gay , growing up in the southside ian probably thought he was the token gay so of course hes going to chase after mickey
he stood by as kash attacked mickey
“Ian didn't do anything to stop Kash from shooting his new lover, and didn't even tell the police about his boss' over-the-top display of jealous action so proper justice could be served.”
okay. because two men he had fallen for had gotten into a fight, there was a gun involved and he panicked, in the end after mickey got shot he went to him
now to address the quote, he didnt say anything to the police because he probably knew that that would bring shame onto kash and his family, along with mickey and his family who are very homophobic
oh yeah and it was like 2011 and cops suck and THEY LIVE ON THE SOUTHSIDE
he and lip tried framing terry milkovich
oh the homophobic and racist dad of his boyfriend and bestfriend who tried to kill him and r*ped his daughter ?
yeah , shit man , that was real bad they shouldn’t have done that /s
he dated jimmy-steves married father
“Ian didn't bother telling Jimmy the truth about his father and didn't end his relationship with Lloyd upon finding out that he had a secret wife and family, either.”
at this point ian is probably sixteen but that doesnt matter bc i wont even address that
he met him at a club and then used his relationship with ned to make mickey jealous which was one of the reasons he kept seeing him, he didnt tell jimmy-steve about the relationship or his father bc he shouldnt find out from him he should find out from his father , again like kash, ned was an older man who payed attention to ian and ned later did develop feelings feelings for ian
he stole lips identity to enlist in the army
he enlisted because he didnt know what to do with himself, its implied/stated that the army timeline was the start of his bipolar
“While impersonating Lip, Ian had tried to steal a helicopter and then proceeded to go AWOL.”
this is because of the bipolar he suffers from, it is referenced later in the series after he gets back and hes manic
ian refused to accept being bipolar
of course he didnt accept it, it is made very clear that his family thinks lowly of monica so of course if hes the lucky duck to get what his siblings demonize her for, of course he’ll not want to be it
“He refused to take medications that could alter his personality or mood.”
okay. this is why im making this whole post, this goes along with part 15 ( or so idk ) ,,
my mother , my dear mother, who is bipolar and doesnt take her meds because they are mood altering , my mom doesnt take med because she told me once that they make her feel like shit, she told me that a little after i was born she started taking them but realized she felt nothing, she felt nothing for my dad or for i ( making her numb )
she told me anti deppresents dont help either because when shes on them and manic it pushes her past productive and into angry
my dad told me that when my mom was on bi polar medication she would seem angry most of the time
he wasnt faitful to mickey
“Ian's bipolar disorder made him very reckless and impulsive and led him to be unfaithful.”
lets break that down.
ians. bipolar. disorder.
this plot point i actually didnt like, mainly bc ian never addresses it so ill give the article a point. but then i take away 2 because they have more of a problem with his bipolar messing with him rather than the fact he never apologized and they never worked it out
ian stole yevgeny
before i start quoting i should mention because his boyfriend, who has supported and helped him is suddenly telling him he needs help, he was helping raise yev so he’ll see yev as his own
“Ian failed to recognize just how crazy he was acting...”
cuting you off right there , he was in a bipolar state, he wasnt ‘crazy’ and isnt ‘crazy’
he cant even keep count of his number of partners
just slutshaming i see
he helped throw frank off a bridge
“His relationship with Frank was understandably never the same after that, as Frank struggled to get over this act of betrayal and cruelty.”
‘was never the same after that’ frank never liked ian, ian was probably his least favorite and that point is very apparent
also , it wasnt just ian , his siblings and his boyfriend caleb
he left a healthy relationship to be with mickey
he fell in love with mickey at 15 , mickey was a comfort and always someone to fall back on, when mickey was taken away and no longer in the picture his heart still obviously was with mickey and when mickey came back he didnt know what to do
he told mickey he had a boyfriend but because mickey has been such a constant in his life he finally has back of course he couldnt resist
he liked trevor, i could tell he did but trevor wasnt the one he watched get r^ped by a russian prostitute, he wasnt the one ian was secretly dating bc it would be a death wish other wise, he wasnt the one there when ian was manic or depressive ( at the start )
he tried blackmailing an old client for money
“Instead of raising the money in an honest manner, Ian chose to visit an old client from his time working at the Fairy Tail and blackmail him into funding the shelter.”
because he felt indebted to trevor and wanted to make it up to him, it would have taken longer to do it in ‘an honest manner’ when his sister would have gotten it instead, he knew how much gay youths like he once was needed a safe place
“He grew up wanting to be nothing like his father, but this whole money-making scheme was straight out of the Frank playbook”
because thats all he knows, he grew up with that ‘playbook’ so of course hes going to take a page out of it, he is nothing like frank , franks money making schemes are selfish and for his own greed while ian wanted the money to help build a safe space for lgbt youth
he let fame inflate his ego
of course he did, hes a southside kid who was destined to fail
also it is very apparent that during the gay jesus era he went off his medication which didnt help
“Before long, he just completely forgot about his ex and focused solely on being a deity”
as much as yes, he did let it mess with his head, he was trying to still help lgbt youth and was going against anti gay churchs , in the end it didnt work out for him because he was off his meds and went over board
he stopped taking his meds
see previous point and ‘ian refused to accept being bipolar’
he actually wanted to stay in prison
because he was doing good in there
ian was helping others and was spreading awareness about lgbt with in the prison , and as him and jail scenes go , we can see people were listening to him and he was trying to make it safe sane and consensual
he let down his army of followers
“Ian admitted that most of his actions were completely irrational and the mere results of his bipolar disorder.”
he didnt want to, we can see this, because he knew he would let down everyone, his family were the only ones to ever ground him and they knew it would be the best option for his own mental health
during the gallavich wedding we can see that a lot of his supporters still have his back because they must know how hard it was for him to put all of that success on something he can’t control
he constantly wasted his potential
this is actually the only point in this article i actually agree with , so only 1/20 i agree with
his relationship with mickey wasn’t actually great
“Mickey spent the first several years of their relationship denying his feelings for Ian.”
he was raised by a homophobic and racist father who he knew would react the way he did when terry had caught the two that one day
“Even after he finally embraced his true self, Ian's bipolar disorder kept them from becoming truly happy together.”
yes but mickey was there for him the entire time and helped him through it, he told him he loved him which was really big for him and did his best to care for him
“They couldn't seem to remain faithful to each other for more than a few weeks.”
back to the point about ians bipolar but for mickey he wanted monogamy , now that scene in s11 may say otherwise but it is very clear that he wants a monogamous relationship with ian and ian ( after getting help ) wants one too, and in the later seasons they are monogamous
“When Mickey asked Ian to run away to Mexico with him, Ian refused.”
he wanted to, it’s obvious, but ian has his family and didnt want to abandon them again, i think part of him knew he would see mickey again because they always find eachother, he gave mickey all of his money and wanted mickey to have a good life
“Their relationship was simply never healthy.”
no it wasnt, but thats why the ship is great in its own way, the gay closet kid raised by a homophobic man is obviously going to have a lot of baggage , and ian who is bipolar and struggling with himself will also have a lot of baggage , but in the end they love eachother and that really shows in season five and season seven specifically
that is all lol ,,, this is long sorry
now, i am not a ian apologist , i love ian but hes a dumbass sometimes
actual valid reasons ian sucks
genuinely believes frank is worse than terry
yes frank was definitely abusive but terry is definitely worse ,,
mentally/physically/sexually abusive , the whole nine yards
terry hired a prostitute to r^pe his son , threatened to kill him and ian on multiple occasions , r^ped his daughter who ended up pregnant and is actively racist
frank on the other hand will make gay jokes but in the end doesnt give enough of a shit , he has attacked his children on multiple occasions but not to the brutality that terry has ( this isnt me excusing it )
sorry ian , terry is worse
never apologized
he never apologized for all the shit he put mickey and his family through, never apologized to mickey for cheating on him , never apologized for all the manic and depressive episodes mickey endured with him
never apologized for walking away when he couldn’t handle it, in hall of shame mickey actually acknowledges this saying ‘its youre whole MO’
debbies sexuality
he has constantly made statements saying debbie isnt gay and that bothers me because , why does it care ? as a gay man and as a gay man who soent time with a lot of lgbt youth wouldnt he support his sister even if shes just ‘experimenting’?
in the recent season he doesnt seem to care and doesn’t say anything but it still bothers me
mickey only getting like 80% of his heart
okay look , i get what ian means when he says this , everyones hes been with has made him who he is but fucking hell dude ,, shut up , thats your husband , thats the love of your life you shouldnt be saying shit like that , especially to him
and then this man had the audacity to say mickey probably feels the same about past flings when he knows that ian is the only one hes probably ever been with/serious about
obviously there is probably more but those are the main ones that come to mind
before anyone brings up the trans or bi thing im going to explain my thought process for him
like ive probably mentioned multiple times he grew up southside and obviously only ever grew up with lgb and not t ,, trevor did inform him a lot and ian became supre accepting of everyone,, sexual preference isnt transphobic but i do think he approached the matter badly
now the bi thing , legit all i think is that he doesnt hate bisexual people its just that the man he really liked slept with a woman and never expressed any heterosexual attraction so it probably just suprised him and pissed him off because caleb did cheat on ian
if you read this far HOLY SHIT THANKS LOL ,, im not adding things that i think are pro about ian this was just me breaking down that article and giving my two cents :)
feel free to message me and talk to me or send me articles like this about any other character/relationship and i will totally break that one down too lol
thanks for letting me rant
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