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#to have a tragic greek gay romance
in-a-closet · 2 years
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…and our joy was so bright we could see nothing else but each other. 🌅
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ray-gurl · 2 months
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3 and 10 for the book asks!
Most recent addition to favorites:
I've probably mentioned this before, but this would have to be Natasha Pulley's The Kingdoms! It has everything I love in a book: excellent attention to detail and world-building, an intricate but never tedious plot, a chunky word count, and complex characters. Plus there's a ton of action, some drama, some gay romance, history, and naval battles! It's also not not a little reminiscent of Black Sails (not in the revolutionary sense, but that the goddamned British Navy features pretty heavily. Also a central character is angry, tragic red-headed officer... so there's some unavoidable James McGraw parallels lmao). Plus the time travel is mind-bending and also uniquely executed. There are some very on-point and funny bits of narration too.
A book I adored and didn't expect to:
Technically this is a Greek Tragedy, but I had to read it for a Classics course I took in college. So it counts! The class focused on ancient women. Side note: not sure whether that professor was queer, but I got vibes from her, and we had a lot of LGBTQ+ content and super inclusive discussions. It was a great time. If you can find Classics professors/courses that acknowledge the field's traditional problems, I promise it will be worth it! PSA over.
The 'book' is Medea by Euripides. Spoilers, Ancient Greece was often quite misogynistic, so if you're-- I'm using the general 'you' here, as I know @poetikat knows better :)-- expecting Feminism... don't. That being said, it is also surprisingly forward-thinking in other regards too. The first time I read it, I was amazed by how authentic she felt. There is a lot of room for debate and analysis, which is very interesting to me. I've re-read it a number of times and always find something new. You can see another book I listed for #10 here.
I was surprised by it because my track record with 'classics' is hit-or-miss (I'm still traumatized by all the 17th and 18th-century American literature I had to read that heavily featured Puritanism *shudders*). Plus even with context, and an interest in the time period, Old Lit Stuff can still be a slog.
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spider-xan · 1 year
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can you please articulate your reasons for opposition to m@deline m!ller in general and the s0ng of ach!lles in particular? Something feels off about it to me, but I can’t identify it, and I was hoping you could.
Sure thing! I'm going to keep this short and casual for now bc there are other people who have written about this in more detail better than me, so this is not a polished post, and there are a lot of issues, but the two major ones are (a) the way Achilles and Patroclus are sanitized and written, and (b) for all the praise that M*ller gets for being a feminist writer, the way she writes women is actually really shitty, though I'm going to focus on Thetis, even though imo her Circe novel isn't even remotely feminist either, despite people saying it was an improvement.
So with Achilles and Patroclus, you have two very complex and extremely flawed characters (let's be honest, Achilles is a rapist who keeps sex slaves) with a very particular kind of romantic/sexual relationship in the cultural understanding of the story (being really careful here to avoid conflating Homer's text with ancient and modern readings), and while ofc changes will be made in a retelling, they may as well be original characters in the book - especially Patroclus, who has zero resemblance to himself in mythology, and it seems like the changes were made specifically to fit into this sanitized uwu softboy gays trope where one man is The Man and the other man is The Woman in very stereotypical ways that also don't fit the setting and doesn't make sense, like, why the fuck is Patroclus even there if war makes him cry and all he does is healing and eating fruit? In the original story, they're both great warriors! That doesn't somehow make them any less gay or whatever! Patroclus crying and being one of the kinder Greeks doesn't make him a woman, especially a stereotypical idea of one! And honestly, I could even ignore it, if it weren't for the fact that people project this back onto the Iliad and other Trojan cycle stories and insist it was there all along when it wasn't.
With Thetis, the book took a woman and tragic figure who was the victim of a forced marriage and rape, whose driving motivation is to protect and save her son from his prophesied early death, only to eventually have to accept that he is doomed and there is nothing she can do, not even as a goddess, and turned her into an evil homophobic step-mother villain who is absurdly obsessed that her son not turn into some kind of homo (as if gods like Zeus and Apollo weren't involved with men) just for homophobic parent drama that doesn't even make sense in the context of the setting and isn't necessary for every story about same-gender relationships; it's also part of an annoying trend where 'feminist' re-tellings will demonize the mother who did nothing wrong and only loved their child and thinks rape is bad into a villain for romance drama and to prop up the men (see: Demeter), which is not very feminist!
But yeah, that's the short version of the two biggest issues that generally come up in criticizing the book and M*ller, though there are definitely other issues and other people have written about all of these in more depth elsewhere, though I hope this helps as a starter.
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johannestevans · 2 years
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Update 21/06/2022
Good evening!
I have been radio silent for a few weeks following illness and am now staying with friends in England for a few months. I'm still a little under the weather as I always get more mental illness symptoms in the summer months, unfortunately, but I'm feeling full of ideas and am excited to work on several things while I'm here, plus some stuff once I'm home in Galway in August!
First, let me rec some new favourite media of late:
Shadow of the Vampire (2000, dir. E. Elias Merhige) - This is a fantastical twist on the filming of Nosferatu, playing with the idea of a real vampire being involved in the production - it does such a lot of fun layering of tropes and convention analysis, looking at Dracula and also broader vampire conventions through the (literal) lens of film and performance, and it really captivated me, I enjoyed it a lot.
The Deep House (2021, dir. Alexandre Bustillo & Julien Maury) - This film has middling reviews because it's stupid as shit and is all vibes, no substance, but that's honestly what I really enjoyed about it - two extremely annoying people (a cishet couple) go to vlog in a haunted house... that's submerged in a lake. That's it. There's no deeper meaning here, no complexity at all, it's just spooky scary vibes while scuba diving and influencing, and so long as you expect nothing more interesting, it's good.
Apartment Zero (1988, dir. Maritn Donovan) - Hey, did you know that Colin Firth starred in a homoerotic psychosexual political thriller set in 80s Buenos Aires? That it's extremely gay and somewhat murder husbands-y, and really very autistic and trauma-focused, whilst also digging a bit into the political backdrop? Because I didn't, and this movie is fucking A.
Joel Kim Booster's Psychosexual (2022, dir. Doron Max Hagay) - Joel Kim Booster's new comedy special which released on Netflix today! It's really good, I really enjoyed it, I've loved JKB's stand-up for a while now so I was super excited to see him get a special of his own, and this one has really fucking delivered, it's such good banter.
Emergency (2022, dir. Carey Williams) - This is an extremely well-crafted comedy/drama, it's so fucking well-written and so stupendously human and complex, and it really digs into the constant fucking fraught dangers of being forced to potentiall rely on emergency services in crisis situations when the cops are literally dangerous to you. I would die for Sean, who's one of the MCs, he's so incredibly sweet and so loving to his friends I just wanted to fucking sob over him by the end.
Ordinary Lies (2015-2016) - I'll be honest, I started watching this because I wanted to thirst over Con O'Neill and Joel Fry, who are in S2, and are both indeed extremely hot and lovable, especially Con. I assumed based off the trailer for S1 that it would be typical cisheterosexual drama rife with bullshit, but to my surprise, it's actually really good, although S1 is significantly better written and balanced than S2. Tragically, most of the characters are indeed bullshit-laden cishets, but because they're almost all demonstrably mental and living absolutely ridiculous lives telling the most outlandish lies to one another for no reason and often for very little conceivable gain, it ends up being genuinely entertaining for all that!
I've also been playing Animal Crossing: New Horizons on my new Switch, and I know that everyone who wants it has already heard of it, but nonetheless, I'm enjoying it and having a good time with it.
New Works Published
Romance Short: Temple Service
A servant at the temple to Hephaestus lusts after an olive-tender.
Rated M, 2.2k, cis M/M, some ancient Greeks! A temple servant and a grove-worker, lots of teasing and banter and flirting. Adapted from a Tweetfic.
Read on Patreon / / Read on Medium
Erotic Short: Festival Prize
A young man is knotted by two wolfmen at a night-time festival.
1.2k, rated E, trans man getting double-knotted by two huge-dicked cis wolfmen! Public sex, double-knotting vaginally and anally, come inflation, overstimulation.
Read on Patreon / / Read on Medium
TweetFic: The Captain's Clerk
Short and horny! A sailor is fascinated by the captain's clerk, and doesn't understand his full purpose aboard.
Exhibitionism, group sex.
Read on Twitter
Our Flag Means Death Fanfic: Repentance & Forgiveness
Rated E, Frenchie/Izzy, Frenchie-centric and exclusively Frenchie POV. 33k+, plot-heavy, WIP. Set post-season 1 - Act I is nearly completed, and is centred on Frenchie on the Queen Anne before Stede Bonnet's triumphant return. Act II will be Stede and Ed's reunion - or clash - and how that affects Frenchie and the others.
On the Queen Anne, Frenchie can't sleep.
Desperate to just get whatever he can away from Blackbeard's crew, he knocks on Izzy's door and invites himself in.
Read on Ao3
Erotic Short: Degrees of Separation
A violinist has a quick tryst with his father’s boyfriend in a coat closet.
1.3k, rated E, cis M/M. Anal sex with protection, big size difference and significant size kink, infidelity, pseudo incest with dirty talk from the dad’s boyfriend about the dad’s preferences in bed, to the son. Use of the word daddy throughout.
Read on Patreon / / Read on Medium
Erotic Short: Lunch Break
Two coworkers run to their car for a quickie.
600w, rated E, cis M/M. Two coworkers run for a quickie on their lunch break — car sex, safe sex, silly teasing sex.
Read on Patreon / / Read on Medium
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Hello, I read your lovely essay on Arthur and the Western! It was so well thought out and well-written. Thank you for that. I was wondering if you've seen the film Brokeback Mountain and your thoughts on where it falls in your discussion of the Western? Do you think the writers of Red Dead reference Brokeback Mountain too? I thought it was notable that such a famous subversion of the masculine cowboy would've been a notable example in your essay.
asdjsak I'm kind of kicking myself right now bc Brokeback Mountain is one of my favorite films and definitely one of my top favorite Westerns (or anti-Western). I can't believe I forgot to include it in my Arthur Morgan essay alskdjsa
I will say that Brokeback was shot in Canada and the short story it's based on is based in Wyoming (iirc, the film's story takes place in Wyoming as well). Big Valley and Mount Shaun are clearly inspired by that region of North America (primarily the Northwestern side of the Rockies), so I think the film's cinematography definitely inspired the fictional landscape of RDR2.
You're absolutely right tho that Brokeback subverts the hypermasculine trope of the Western, with the choice of making the story revolve around a tragic gay romance. I'm not sure if you know what a pastoral is? It's an ancient Greek form of poetry (still used today as a genre) that usually focuses on shepherds taking a break from herding sheep to sing songs and partake in otium (leisurely rest), and these poems are often homoerotically charged if not explicitly homosexual in imagery and content. I think Brokeback is more of a pastoral than a Western, especially since there's an absence of gunslinging, which I would argue is kind of a definitive trait of the Western and its subgenres. Pastoral poetry are tragic as well, as they often lament the dispossession of land and the encroachment of the city on the country, further pushing the shepherds (and cowboys are modern day shepherds) to the borderlands.
I'll have to get back to you in terms of what this means for RDR2. I think a lot of Arthur's pensiveness and moments of quiet self-reflection (particularly the animation where he wakes up leaning on a rock) must have taken inspiration from Brokeback, as there are so many shots of Jack and Ennis doing just that in their quiet pastoral retreat. Thank you so much for this food of thought. I will definitely think more on this!
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thatsnotxitsy · 2 years
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That's not aromantic that's you just hating love
Aromantic - a person who doesn't feel romantic love/rarely feels romantic love.
Even though that statement is in some ways a little vague, accounting for the greyness in the area, it is very clear in others. If you consider this label to fit you, it's because your feelings of romantic love have never surfaced, may never surface or perhaps do so in such an infrequent manner as for this label to still fit.
But more and more there seems a rise in 'aro' people who have rejected the very concept of love in all forms and use their aro status to justify some very unfair and ridiculous statements. Statements that are the very reason other community members (I'm talking LGBT+ here) see you as being against them* or at the very least, incredibly hostile, unfriendly and difficult to talk to or express themselves around. If this is what you wish to do - do away with platonic love, love for oneself, love for objects, love for activities, love for life (the Greeks knew what was going on when they named a lot of different types of love) then you are perfectly fine to do so. Happiness and contentment may look a certain way for you and another for others. But then I see statements like "Iconic lines from romance movies are arophobic." or "Love is Love*^ is actually a terrible slogan because it excludes aro people." You cannot expect the whole world to not talk about love, except in vague ways which water-down it's importance and the happiness it brings in order to accommodate you. No more than hetero people can do away with ss attraction and importance. Love is important. Love has done many great and terrible things for people all throughout history. Love has pulled people, communities, hundreds of people through tragic events and hard times for centuries. Love has enriched people's lives and made them worth living. It doesn't mean it's 'necessary' to live a full life, or to do good things for people, but it has done, will do, is doing and will continue to do this things for those who feel it and that's a fact.
You cannot as an aro person say "I understand, appreciate and validate that allos feel this way and that love is very important to them" but forbid the expression of it in your implications of it being 'arophobic or 'aphobic' to do so. ** That's like a straight man saying "I understand, appreciate and validate that gay men like men but could they not have shows where gay men get together, songs about loving men, posts online about loving men and basically express this love in a place I might see it because it excludes me as a straight man from projecting onto it and makes me uncomfortable to see/hear?" The world you sometimes speak of it's one that is 'aro friendly' it's one where love is censored. A blank world where people have sex not because of attraction or feeling aroused but because of procreation and 'because you should' (after all, demonising feeling sexual attraction or 'being horny' is also common in the same circles). That is not a world that exists, nor should it exist. The world which exists now is a diverse one. Your main issue should just be standing up for yourself as an aro person and showing the other ways in which you find happiness. In other words, legitimising aromanticism. If you must make your life revolve around your sexuality labels at all. It should not be telling those who feel love that they are banned from words like 'loveless' because they're not aro, or that the presence of love in media is automatically arophobic even if no actual direct reference to 'if you don't have love how can you ever be happy' is really, truly made, except when you squint to see it and stretch really hard. If you find yourself offended by any talk of love, you just hate love, it has nothing to do with being aromantic. Sincerely, a fellow nb aroace - Gravy [Chalk Circle System] ^ 'Love is Love' is intentionally simplistic so it can have a wide meaning with variations depending on the person. Love is Love for aro people could simply mean 'my form of love is no love'. It is that vague for a reason. **I often wonder what aro people like this would be like as parents. I can't imagine you would possibly get offended if your child was allo and wanted to say 'I love you' and hear it back. But you sure act like you would be that callous as to deny it even empty words of love to make it feel warm and safe. It can learn to understand your aro standpoint when it's older.
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denimbex1986 · 1 month
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'All of Us Strangers, starring Andrew Scott and Paul Mescal, is a realistic and deeply moving love story, much more than just a queer romance. A reminder of the tenderness sought by the alienated creatures of the adult world, a film that comes to exonerate loneliness and, above all, the shame that accompanies it.
In All of Us Strangers , shown in Greek cinemas from February 15 , Adam (Andrew Scott) is a lonely gay screenwriter in his forties and the only tenant - or so he thinks - in a skyscraper on the edge of modern London. One night Harry (Paul Mescal), the neighbor and only person living in the apartment building, knocks on his door . Despite Adam's initial hesitations, a romance soon begins between them that gradually leads to a deep bond and allows them to navigate the complexities of their loneliness together.
As their relationship develops, Adam is overwhelmed by memories of the past and back and forth between the country town where he grew up and his childhood home, in which his parents (Claire Foy & Jamie Bell) seem to still live , just like the day who were killed, 30 years ago.
Drawing inspiration from the Japanese novel "Strangers" (1987) by Taichi Yamada, but also Olivia Laing's book, "The Lonely City", the new film by the British Andrew Hague, one of the most resounding absences at this year's Oscars, delves into the often stigmatized feeling of loneliness and tells a heartbreaking, almost hypnotic story of love, loneliness and loss . As the director explains: "The protagonist feels like he's the only person there is, because that's loneliness - it doesn't matter if there are 10,000 people around - you just feel it instinctively."
A strange thing happens in Adam's life: in a mysterious way, although dead for many years, his parents still live in his father's house and even welcome him there.
The characters of All of Us Strangers have a realistic misery and a familiar loneliness that works multiplyingly as long as it is experienced against the background of the modern urban landscape of the bustling metropolis , where it is easier to get lost than to be found, where it is easier to close than to connect, where everyone is unknown to each other and unknown to themselves.
Our story takes us back in time and to the sudden coming of age of Adam, when a tragic event happened, the most tragic of all for the psyche of a small man: the sudden loss of his parents-caregivers, which marked the end of joy and carefree in his life. A story that reaches today, the "ghosts" of the mind and the desperate ease with which we are often led to resignation and alienation.
The emotional burden of the film is carried on his shoulders by the main character, played by Andrew Scott (Priest of " Fleabag ") in a role of a lifetime.-
Adam is an orphan, unrelated and lonely. He carries the burden of mourning from his parents' accident and beyond, a burden that in a climate of denial he himself characterizes as "cliché", with that -always- beautiful and unsurpassably sad smile that, however, lights up his entire face. "Adam is a very lonely figure. It was a difficult role in the sense that it puts you in difficult areas. But it's also a privilege in a way," comments actor Andrew Scott about the character he embodies better than anyone else could.
“Andrew Scott was on my mind from the beginning. I admire him as an actor . And while it's not necessary with every queer role, it was important to me that the protagonist share the same sexuality as the character. The film has many nuances and I needed someone who can understand it deeply ," explains the film's director, Andrew Haig.
All of Us Strangers is full of images of loneliness in the city, with the film's imagery echoing the solitary figures of Edward Hopper and the anguished portraits of Francis Bacon. "These images look like people trapped and lost in something," said the director after his film won seven awards at the British Independent Film Awards.
“Living in a big city, you feel like there should be so many possibilities to connect. There are so many other lives and yet you can't connect to them," he says.
Some things cannot be described in words
The performances of Andrew Scott and Paul Mescal are extremely strong, while the director of "Lean on Pete", "45 Years", "Weekend", "Greek Pete" signs here a transcendent masterpiece.
Even though Adam's parents have been dead for 30 years, the burden remains heavy. When he decides to share it, Harry stands by him in the most "empathetic" way:
– Harry: This your mum and dad? – Adam: Yeah. They died just before I was twelve. – Harry : I'm really sorry. – Adam : Oh, thanks. It was a long time ago. – Harry: I don't think that matters. I can't even begin to imagine how lonely you must have been.
And somewhere there, Adam's deeply personal experience becomes universal and "clips" on everything that is covered daily by a veil of silence: How to describe death and terror, loss or madness of the mind? How to share the content of one's existential void when there are no words to express it? Where, towards the other, we can simply listen, sympathize and empathize with the fact that we all contain the same void, possibly come from the same void, experience the same anguish , have the same questions and seek similar answers. " Our roots are common. We all come from the same womb. Each person is thrown from the same abyss, struggling to achieve his goal. We understand each other, but each man can only explain himself," writes Esse to "Demian". How different is the abyss that separates and unites the protagonists from ours? From our own difficulty to let the light in, to make love a purpose and connect ? Love is the light / Scaring darkness away, yeah / Purge the soul / Make love your goal which can also be heard in the final scene ...
According to the director, 'All of Us Strangers' is a realistic love story. We add: “Loving someone doesn't mean all your problems go away. I wish it were like that, but it isn't. These two people keep fighting to get back in the room with each other." And it's one of the most touching cinematic love stories precisely because it's realistic , while obviously being much more than just a tender queer romance. Adam himself catches up with us when, unraveling the tangle of his life and childhood pains, he tells Harry that his sexual identity has always been one of many - not painless - additions to the "knot" he felt inside him as a child , especially from the shock of loss onwards.
The film is a dramatic "jolt", a virtuoso reminder of the tenderness, acceptance and caress that human beings crave as an antidote to the loneliness of the adult world and the unseen and unspeakable that hurt and alienate us . And it's a film that takes part in the larger recent cinematic conversation about humanizing loneliness and challenging social stigma , like Sofia Coppola's Priscilla and Luna Carmoon 's Hoard .
"I know what it's like to not care about yourself anymore"
Andrew Hague's new film is showing in Greek cinemas from February 15 and is one of those that you should definitely see. It's also, sadly, one of the most resounding absences at the 2024 Oscars.
All of Us Strangers is a film that penetrates you in a unique, almost hypnotic way and you don't easily forget. You may feel identified with the melancholic story of the protagonists, you may not, but what is certain is that it cannot leave you unmoved . It is one of the best films of the year, without exaggeration we could say one of the best films we have seen in general.
With a disarming naturalness and an extraordinary sensitivity that does not stray into tearful melodrama, the film reminds us of the need for tenderness and the power of love which, although it does not save, heals at least temporarily, while it achieves what it probably intended from the beginning: to destigmatize loneliness and , mainly, to exonerate the shame that accompanies it in adult life - especially after thirty.
'I know what it's like to stop caring about yourself' , says Harry to Adam at one point. It is perhaps the most characteristic line of the film, the most visceral and "cathartic" admission that connects the two heroes. Their common abyss.'
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maddie-feely · 2 years
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This is mainly a personal blog to try and dish out a few ideas for my story. It is currently titled “Life is a Journey for Two”. Based in Ancient Greece, I’m depicting a different ideology of the time and a tragic (of course) romance story between the two main characters.
It is essentially an Ancient Greece gay romance, but not based on gods or any well known heroes of the time. It is simply going to be a few commoners and will have no interjections of the gods. They will be mentioned, but despite many Greek mythological stories, the gods will not be a sole focus, nor will any well known places or people.
It is currently written in third person, but I am considering changing it to first person. My biggest struggle is figuring out how to begin the book itself. I have so much of the middle and ending planned, but I legitimately have NO IDEA how to begin it.
As I was saying, this blog will be used to help spew some ideas. It’s more personal, but I will always be open to ideas. Constructive criticism is always welcomed, but know this is a judgment free zone and no idea is a bad idea :)
Thank you to anyone who happens to come upon this page and take the time to read.
For future reference, I may write chapter by chapter. Some ideas may be spoilers for the actual book, but a warning will be given, as well as for any triggers.
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seeminglyseph · 3 years
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i ordered food from a movie theatre ‘cause they had cotton candy. I am going to try and sort some stuff out. again. completely beginning tonight with an intent to sort out a basic start to a timeline and maybe some base character traits to spin off of. (sometimes I don’t even keep the initial trait it’s just like a concept to start with.) try and figure out a vague timeline I can bullshit because... Ares is Dionysus’ great grandfather and Hermes was basically his babysitter and Apollo is older than Hermes and like how far do we go to bring in the like... concepts. The fates and children of Zeus that have fewer stories but are concepts and things that happen. Do I want to visually define the Titans from the Olympians? often they’re depicted bigger but also some of them get together with Olympians without question.... idk. there’s so much like....... history before Dionysus was born that sometimes it’s like ‘okay but then how do I explain the whole history of zeus and stuff???’ but I think I’ll slowly have Dionysus figure it out, that’s the most natural way for a story to work...
But I also want to work in stories of other gods ‘cause they are all super interesting so probably I can work stuff in like Apollo talking about Hyacinthus or Eros and Psyche fitting in.. plus since I’m taking liberties I can do stuff like have other myths that should have happened earlier happening at the same time @_@;;;; like during Dionysus’ journey somewhere in the background the labours of Heracles are going on... Since Perseus and Theseus affect Dionysus’ life I have to figure out how to fold them in and I get to consider doing horrible things to their bones. I have to.... figure out how to deal with Nycaea somehow and it might end up being another case of Eros being of an entirely chaotic neutral energy. it is written that Eros hits him with the arrow. I know there’s a lot of stuff that I could just write off or write out, but I’d like to see if there’s a way to make it work first... I’m gonna at least put down my thoughts if I can’t motivate myself to start drawing. Maybe collecting some references. I’m spending tonight indulgently reading articles on theoi and thinking about how I can definitely not host something this gory, incestuous or full of sexual violence as this on like.... fucking webtoon. (I do appreciate hosting sites like this for having a catalogue of titles I can find and it does a lot, buuuuuut I want to be an edgelord. also good lord, could you imagine trying to make a greek myth webtoon right now? I am not competing with that aesthetic. that art style was the smartest fucking thing to hit webcomics in ages. like it or not it catches your eye and that can be more than enough. I’m not capable of an art style that pops that much nor do I want that general an audience.
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forestlion · 3 years
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€urop€an movie rec list, fuck you, the usa
La Daronne (2020). Humorous French movie starring (inter)national super star Isabelle Huppert in a more comedic role that makes you think. This queen is not at all versed in Arabic or Yiddish and or of non-French descent in any way. You would be right. Her husband is Lebanese though. This movie is about drugs and funny in the way that I assume French people enjoy comedy.
En man som heter Ove (2015). A Swedish drama, based on a well-known book. Sad, heartwarming, comedic elements even, mostly tragic. It is a Scandi film, so. No surprises there. TW suicide attempts! I liked it alright, sure, for a Scandinavian movie. No offence to Northern Europe but Jesus Christ.
And Then We Danced (2019). A Swedish-Georgian production about a Georgian dancer (traditional) who falls in love w a fellow danceur. Gay romance, heartwarming, tragic but beautiful. Triggered controversy in Georgia (religion/church-related), so big big props to the actors, producers and crew. Very very good movie.
Tschick (2016). German dramedy/coming-of-age movie based on a novel (RIP Wolfgang Herrndorf). It's a fantastic movie about two boys (one of them Russlanddeutscher and gay) stealing a car and adventuring through the country formerly known as GDR.
Lara (2019). Also a German film and if you have mommy issues, this is thee movie for YOU. Corinna Harfouch is a milf and why are we gagging? She brings it to us every ball. It's about unreachable expectations, loneliness and playing the piano. Tom Schilling is also in it.
Dogtooth (2009). A Greek thriller? Drama? Indie horror? About a fucked up family. Like. Truly fucked up. Can I rec this movie? I don't know. I fear this is the kind of European film that makes the Yanks think. What on God's green earth. And they'd be right.
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womenofwonder · 3 years
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Option on RWBY ships:
Btw, I don’t usually ship characters. Romance is usually the least interesting part of the story for me so expect a lot of meh.
Arkos: obviously I love this, it’s perfect
Blacksun: ehh, it’s cute. I started out feeling kinda meh, it was sweet but not really interesting, but now it’s growing on me. Ironically the same thing is happening with Bumblebee, although I still like Blake and Yang better platonically
Bunanas: so this is a ship between Velvet and Sun, and it’s honestly really cute to imagine even if it is completely random. I like it better then Blacksun…I think?
Candy Cane: this is just weird. I can’t imagine Nora being anything but a older sister to Oscar. The age gap makes it creepy too, not the four years is much of a gap, but when your teenagers it’s a big gap.
Chocolate Arc: this is hilarious to imagine but obviously yeah, Coco isn’t going to fall for someone like Jaune
Cinnabun: I barely know anything about Yatsuhashi but he and Velvet are cute, I guess? Still like her better with Sun
ClockRose: heck no!
Coconuts: again, can’t see Sun doing anything but annoying Coco. I really don’t like the whole ‘badass jerk of a girl falls for goof ball trope.’ It always ends up feeling sexist in several ways
Combat Boots: honestly outside of an AU I can’t see Yang ever forgiving Mercury much less falling in love with him. Also Mercury just doesn’t deserve her
Combat goggles: I feel like Yang and Neptune would have fun causally dating each other and slowly realizing they actually like (Blake/Sun/Jaune/whoever) and become each other’s wingmen. That fanfic better be lying around somewhere
Crimson Lotus: okay, if I didn’t love Renora and Rosegarden so much I’d probably ship this. It’s really cute
Crimson Sun: this feels like an excuse to write lemons of the two hottest characters
Crimson wings: look I understand most of the shipping heroes with villains because they’re both hot and the villain/hero dynamic is always fun. But Cardin…he’s not even hot. He’s not even interesting. And yet people ship him with Ruby? Why?
Daddie Issues: you know I see where this is coming from but they would just end up murdering each other.
Dairy Farm: obviously this is downright creepy in cannon, but in an au where Neo isn’t evil and both are closer in age, this would be adorable. I feel like Neo’s main problem is she’s incredibly lonely—other then Roman no one bothers to understand or talk to her. If Oscar reached out to her, and she began to protect him…it would be perfect. In way even better then Rosegarden because I think Neo would still be a bit of pycho even when good, and it would be fun to see her lose it when Salem hurts him.
Ilia/Adam: I just want to say I am forever grateful the show went out of its way to avoid this obnoxious, cliche ship from being canon
Dragon slayer: I see why people ship Jaune and Yang, I really do. They’re both the team mom/dad of their team, they’ve got the whole goofball/badass thing going (which is a trope I do like when the badass isn’t a jerk), they both have a good sense of humor, etc. But I just can’t see them as romantic. It feels really weird. I can’t even explain why. I understand shipping them but I really can’t ship them myself.
Emercury: I really love this ship, but I also don’t mind at all if the show decides to make them platonic. I enjoy their relationship in general and it works either way.
Oscar/Emerald: again, feel creepy. I love the idea of a sibling relationship and can’t see them possibly being romantic even without the age gape.
Cinder/Qrow: yeah again. Both are sexy and good for angsty lemons. I’m not into that stuff so I don’t ship them
Fall Stinger: I just don’t know why anyone would ship Tyrian with anyone. Unless it was Salem and even that is super creepy
Firerobber: I like villain relationships but Roman already has Neo and Cinder is a hot mess. Literally
Firewall: I don’t know why anyone would ship Watts with anyone. He’s even worst less ship-able then Tyrian
Footloose: I don’t actually ship it but just imagine Mercury and Melanie bonding over weaponized feet.
Freckles: Yeah this is just painful. The two most adorable characters (Penny and Oscar), who go through the worst things imaginable. It’s endless fluff, angst, and whump, and I love cute romance and tragic romances, so this is definitely something I ship.
Frostbite: seriously, this is so weird and toxic. Having Adam fall for Weiss or vice versa. Maybe it would work in an AU or something but it’s just too creepy
Funky Beats: it’s cute, I ship it.
Gelato: yeah I love healthy villainous relationships! Neo and Roman are freaking adorable, and I’m sad that we didn’t see more of them together.
Grandmasters: I obviously don’t ship Salem and Ozpin because that’s just creepy, but I do like their romance. I like tragic romances, and this probably the most tragic one in existence
Greek Lotus: I don’t see the chemistry and crashes two of my favorite ships so…
Green Knight: well, she kinda helped kill his last girlfriend so…unless it’s AU this isn’t going to work. Even if it is an AU. This feels like another ship made solely for lemons
Velvet/Cardin: yeah, a bigot changing his mind when he falls in love with a minority isn’t cute. Isn’t sweet. It isn’t romantic. I don’t even excuse lemons that use this trope. Even porn ought to be above that
Weiss/Cardin: WOULD EVERYONE STOP SHIPPING CARDIN WITH PEOPLE
Hummingbird: it’s hard to ship something when you only know one character, but I was interested in the theory that Qrow was actually Ruby’s father. But then in season 7 Qrow’s description of Summer made me rethink it, and it didn’t sound anything like how you’d describe a romantic relationship. So I don’t really like that theory anymore
Iceberg: this is just cliche and boring. I get them dating but it wouldn’t last that long
Flynt/Weiss: I really love this one, it’s my favorite ship with Weiss. I don’t want it to actually happened in cannon because that would be random, but I feel like it would be fun for both their characters. And they both share an interest in music. I’m imagining an AU where he gets her into jazz and she starts singing it at all her concerts to the horror of Jaques.
Iron Maiden: honestly what. Why. Gross
Iron witch: well I definitely see why people like it. I actually wouldn’t mind it being cannon, It’d be a good combination of funny/tragic and I’d like to see Glynda mentoring Winter
Jailbirds: this just feels forced and also Qrow is probably too old for her. I like their relationship and don’t want it to be romantic
Knight fall: lemon ship. Moving on
Knight Life: I feel like Jaune just gets shipped with everyone but this is cute I guess
Lancaster: it’s cute, but I can’t ship it because it feels cliche. I was worried that Jaune was going to be her love interest when they first met and was relieved to see him with Pyrrha instead. It just feels forced and boring to have him end up with Ruby
Pyrrha/Mercury: this really popular for some unfathomable reason. I like Mercury but Pyrrha deserves better
Marrowgold (May/Marrow): I just don’t see it
Nikong: Pyrrha and Sun would be cute together, but I don’t really love this ship. It’s kinda meh.
Nora’s Arc: no. Just no. It technically would work but their platonic relationship is way too good to lose
Old Silver: this is Maria/Pietro, and I think it’s adorable. They both strike me as really flirty for their ages and both are very good mentors. They can be the crazy grandparents of the team
Ozglyn: just don’t see it
Phoenix: yeah Raven was a horrible girlfriend/wife. I don’t ship her Taiyang
QuickSilver: Ruby deserves better than Mercury.
Rehab (Qrow/Glynda): the fact that this is called rehab explains why I don’t ship it
ReNora: yeah, this is probably my favorite ship. I don’t think I have to explain why.
Robotic Knight: I briefly shipped this but now disagree
Rosegarden: I really love Rosegarden, they’re just too adorable together, though the whole Ozpin does make it a little awkward
Rosewick: I can’t see this happening, even in an AU
Coco/Fox: I don’t know enough about Fox to really ship them, but the fact that Coco canonically slaps his butt during battle definitely makes me want to
Mercury/Neo: I could see this working. It would be pretty cute
Silent Knight: again, it would have to be an AU and even then I don’t see it working
Snowbird: so at first I really liked the idea of Qrow and Winter being ex’s, but now that I think about it he has to be at least twenty years older then her. Also, I have to say that while they have chemistry I think they would just end up killing each other
Speakeasy (Flynt/Coco): I got to say I like this ship and could see them having a lot of chemistry together
Strawbanna: I just can’t see Ruby and Sun together. It feels weird
Sunflakes: Can’t see it working
Sunflowyr (Ren/Yang): don’t see any chemistry. Again this just seems random
Tauradonna: this is obviously as toxic as you get.
The Hunt (Cardin/Blake): stop shipping Cardin with anyone!
Mercury/Cinder: Mercury is way too young, and even if he wasn’t this would be really weird. Also Cinder makes him look like a stable, peaceful person, so also no.
Toxic Petals: I swear I’m done with this. No more Cardin, Tyrian, or Watts ships. They too gross
Velveteen Knight: Aw, they’d be cute together
White Knight: I really hate this ship. It’s so obnoxious and boring, and nearly falls into the jerky badass/goofball trope I hate
Winter Soldier: ew, no, Ironwood is like her dad
Wise Dragon: anyone care to explain why this is so popular? Sage barely has any character to him, I can’t ship him with anyone
Yellow rose: Yeah, I kinda ship this, but again, it’s difficult when you barely know one character
IronQrow: I understand why you would ship this but I just don’t see it. Guys can hug without being gay you know
Martial arts: why?
Noah’s Arc: why?
Sea Monkeys: again I understand why you could ship it but I don’t. They’re obviously just friends to me
Shovel Knight: like most Oscar ships it feels weird. Jaune is obviously a big brother to him
TaiQrow: As funny as it is for Tai to sleep with every member of his team, I don’t ship it.
Fair game: I really can’t stand Clover so again, don’t ship it
Achilles heel: Cinder literally kills Pyrrha, why would you ship them?
Baked Alaska: lemon ship
Black glass: annnd, another lemon ship.
Blood Mint: yeah I don’t see Emerald and Ruby ever being a couple
Catmelon: I found Ilia’s crush on Blake kinda cringy and I can’t see them being a couple
ColdMurder (Weiss/Cinder): even in an au I don’t see it working
Cold Steel (Penny/Winter) eeewww, they’re practically sisters
Cream Machine (Neo/Penny): I mean…if she wasn’t evil…and wasn’t so much older…it might work? Maybe?
Crosshares: cute but I feel like Velvet is too much of a doormat for Coco
Digital Clock: Ciel obviously didn’t care much for Penny, and she was barely a character at all. I don’t see it
Pyrrha/Nora: don’t see it, and also can’t stand the idea of breaking up the two best ships
Falling Petals: I get that Cinder is hot, but can we stop shipping her with the kids she’s trying to murder? Because I can see several things wrong with that
Freezerburn: again, for no reason that I can think of this ship just doesn’t work for me. Much like Dragonslayer it just feels weird
Gingersnaps (Penny/Nora): that would be chaotic. I can’t really see them romantically though like most Penny ships it would be cute
Guilty Conscience (Bree/Winter): oh please no. They really don’t have any reason to be together
Ladybug: I just can’t see Blake with Ruby at all. Blake feels way to old even though she’s only older by two years.
Milk and Cereal (Ruby and Pyrrha): I guess it would work but I just don’t any chemistry
Mint chocolate (Emerald/Coco): if Coco managed to forgive her for everything that happened at Beacon I could maybe see this happening. There is some chemistry
Mommy issues: Nah, can’t see this working out.
Monochrome: Blake and Weiss have never had any romance chemistry despite plenty of opportunity to have it, so again, I see them as strictly platonic and shipping them feels almost like incest. I know that doesn’t make sense
Nordic Winter: I can’t see Weiss handling Penny, but again, any Penny ship is pretty cute
Nuts and Dolts: I would ship, but I like them together platonically too well. Definitely understand the ship, though I find it funny that Ruby, who insist she likes weapons better then people, would fall in love with a personified weapon. I know that’s probably racist against robots
Overheating (Penny/Cinder): I take back what I said about every Penny ship being cute
PennyWeiss: but this one is pretty cute
Pink Lemonade: can you imagine the chaos of Yang and Nora dating each other? They both need someone with a cooler head to keep them in check
Scheenoks: with Weiss’s fangirling I can definitely see were this is coming from, but Weiss is too mean for Pyrrha
Steadfast: I really don’t ship any of the ace-ops with anyone. I found them all boring and annoying except for Marrow
Strawberry Shortcake (Neo/Ruby): not seeing it
Sugar Rush (Ruby/Nora): Again, too much chaos. They both need chill partners. And I love Rosegarden and ReNora too much
Thunder cat (Blake/Nora): don’t see any chemistry between them
WhiteRose: I can see why this is shipped and I don’t dislike WhiteRose shippers. I just prefer Rosegarden, and find Weiss and Ruby working better together romantically
Bumblebee: again, I see this working better platonically, not romantically. It kind of annoyed me at first, but it is growing on me, much like Blacksun. I still like Blacksun better though
Enabler: No.
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ethernetchord · 3 years
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lets talk: popular iwwv criticism
(disclaimer: i know criticism is subjective and thats why im doing this, i wanna look at some common points made against iwwv and dissect them just a little bit in the opposite direction. also none of this is directed at any individual- it’s all based on the general talking points i’ve seen surrounding the book.)
SPOILER WARNING !!
lack of exploration into james and oliver (+ gay characters feel performative)
i’ve seen loads of people say that oliver and james’ relationship felt very performative, a way of including the queer romnce which clearly is very important to the plot but not actually giving it any space in the novel, nor developing it to the same extent which meredith/oliver was.
oliver and meredith had a very strictly physical relationship and while he did love her, he wasn’t in love with her the way he was with james. the juxtaposition in the way that oliver/james is delivered and the way meredith/oliver is delivered is, i believe, far too repetitive to not be intentional. i actually realised upon re-reading how much focus there really is on meredith’s sexuality, even in subtleties in the book. meredith and oliver get more blatant sex scenes, get more physical parts because oliver was (to an extent) using his attraction to meredith to distract himself from his infatuation with james.
we also have to remember that oliver and james didn’t get their real moment of honesty about their relationship till extremely late into the book. i’d honestly see it as more ‘performative’ to then after or in the middle of kind lear throwing in some wild sex scene between the two. it wouldn't have fit.
“why didn’t james and oliver get together earlier then >:(((“ because the slow burn between them, the subtext, the subtle-ness, the yearning, they were all crucial to the decision which oliver made at the end. the fact that they burned so bright for each other but (oliver particularly) were so desperately repressed, that was what made this such a tragic romance. yes its tiring to read stories about queer people being repressed, yes its tiring to see the bury your gays trope. but like oliver says, it goes beyond gender.
if oliver’s second love interest was a girl, and treated this way, we’d be a lot more on board with these tropes- but the fact that james is a man, and this therefor becomes a queer relationship, makes it feel performative. i can’t convince you of anything- but i like to believe that their relationship being treated like this not only makes it so much more “heart wrenching because why! why couldn’t it work out, why couldn’t it be better!” - not because its a queer relationship but because they were soulmates.
alexander wasn’t performative. not in the slightest, rio just didn’t make being gay his entire identity. same goes for colin. just because they’re queer doesn’t mean it needs to be the only thing about them. this isn’t a lgbt novel- characters dont have to be gay just for plot. they can just be gay.
i’ve also seen people complain about not just making oliver bisexual. guys. did you read the book? he was bisexual. he was emotionally and physically attracted to both meredith and james. guys that’s literally what bisexual means.
i'm totally on board with the coming out scenes! and realisation of feelings and all that stuff- but again, not an lgbt centric novel and also- these were things oliver probably did and realised far before this book. remember that its set in 4th year, at an art school. he knew he was fruity ok. not every queer character in every queer book have to have these grandious coming out scenes or realisations. the lack there of doesn’t equal performance.
the ending was rushed and bad
believe what you will, but i don’t think james is dead. there’s a little too much ambiguity in that ending, in the extract he leaves oliver, in the “his body was never found.” so if your main quarrel with the ending is that “bury your gays” situation- please know there’s a chance- and that giving it that chance opens up so much more discussion and reader response.
yes, the ending is sad. but it’s not rushed. “but that is how a tragedy like ours or king lears breaks your heart- by making you believe the ending might still be happy until the very last second.” doing king lear, doing macbeth, doing romeo and juliet, the plays are chosen not only for reader convenience (they’re plays readers will most likely be familiar with) but also because they all, so very deeply, foreshadow a “bad” ending. killing james, makes sense. as much as people don’t want to hear it, from an authorial perspective- from the reader’s perspective and as a human being it makes sense. why do keep arguing that he “should’ve stayed alive for oliver” or that “if he really loved oliver he wouldn’t have done it” - why are we limiting a character’s entire existence down to their love interest. yes, they were best friends, yes they were set up as lovers but that doesn’t mean that that would be enough to keep james around. james was a fragile character- he was always checking with oliver if he had upset him, he was always worried, overthinking, james wasn’t strong minded- and he was suffering. the only person he had left to depend on was in prison, he was plagued with the guilt of causing the death of a classmate and letting oliver take the blame, if he did kill himself, it sure as hell doesn’t have any reason to sound forced.
“its not nearly as good as the secret history!!!!”
to be honest here buds, why the fuck do we keep comparing them so insistently. they are not the same book. iwwv wasn’t trying to be tsh 2.0, yes there are similarities because hey! guess what! books in similar genres tend to do that! always comparing it tsh when they have different motives, different plots and vastly different execution makes no sense. the only reason that they are compared is because tumblrtm dark academics like to group the two together. and yea- makes sense, but stop trying to belittle iwwv because it isn't as grandiose as tsh, because it’s a little more literal, because it’s not as intertextual as tsh. half the people saying iwwv isn’t as good as tsh are practically just subtly going “shakespeare isn’t as complicated as ancient greek huehue” stop forcing the two together and let them be separately appreciated.
the characters were flat/archetypes/etc
sigh. okay.
these characters are actors. this book shows us their transition from themselves entirely into a conjunction of the roles they’ve played and the stereotypes they’ve portrayed.
“we were so easily manipulated - confusion made a masterpiece of us.”
“for us, everything was a performance”
“imagine having all your own thoughts and feelings tangled up with all the thoughts and feelings of a whole other person. it can be hard, sometimes, to sort out which is which.”
“far too many times i had asked myself whether art was imitating life or if it was the other way around”
“it’s easier now to be romeo, or macbeth, or brutus, or edmund. someone else.”
are you seeing it now? this focus on their archetypes, this focus on the character they are; the way they see themselves not merely as human but as a walking concoction of every character they have turned into and out of. they depend on their archetypes to give them meaning. rio uses these archetypes to remind us of the submersion of her characters. they weren’t flat, their intentional lack of dimension due to their pasts is what makes them so intricate. furthermore, there's an evident subversion- the tyrant becomes a victim, the hero becomes a villain (they all become villains really), the ingenue becomes corrupted. like mentioned before, i think we forget ourselves easily reading this book but there is a great deal of emphasis on this being their last year- which is so important. the damage has been done and a lot of the issues people have with the content (or lack thereof) in this book has to do with the fact that it’s all things that would have occurred in books focusing on previous years at delletcher.
“it didn't live up to expectation” (also leading on from read tsh to this and being ‘disappointed’)
i cant argue this because its entirely subjective. whatever expectation was created for you, i cannot know that and appropriately respond however- if you liked the secret history and understood the secret history then there's a good chance you also liked and understood this book- even if not to the same extent but you must be able to recognize the authorial approach and its significance. i think a lot of ppl read iwwv (and a lot of “dark academia” texts and films) and hope to be able to romanticize the aesthetic or the concepts and then are disappointed when they are presented with mildly unlikeable and overwhelmingly human characters who aren’t easy to romanticize.
a great majority of these books are criticisms of the very culture you’re trying to romanticize, and the only time you’re willing to admit that is when boasting about the ‘self-awareness’ of the people indulging in them, and then a moment later complain about those same qualities because they don’t serve this idealized expectation.
bad rep for arts/liberal arts/ humanities students as being pretentious/cultish
as a humanities student with a great love for eng lit- all of these things are indeed pretentious and cultish. not all the time and not always and not every person- but it is a common theme. academia is overwhelmingly obsessive and extremely white-washed. people become so fast to believe that they are indulging in finer arts and are therefore a higher standard of person. academia is problematic. and the recent influx of people interested in it is good, very good because hopefully, we’ll be more diverse, more open-minded, more accepting. that's what i hope at least. if you know, as an individual, that you’re not a pretentious academic who places themselves above non-academics then that's wonderful- but there are dangers and negative sides to academia that need to be understood so that we can see to not perpetuating them.
i cant refute all points, mostly because there's a lot of good and well-explained criticism because no book is perfect. and my intentions are not to belittle anyone's opinion. these are merely opposing arguments, food for thought and to be fair- a critical look into why not everything is always going to be what we expect of it and why every ‘problem’ can be assessed.
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antiloreolympus · 2 years
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10 Anti LO Asks
1. Persephone hasn’t finished a semester of school-wants to apply to law school. Makes sense right? Haha. 
2. WHY is cerberus so generic?? and he's not even a greek breed (or any of the other dogs)?? like was it really that hard to google some greek breeds? they have some big intimidating dogs too, but i guess thats asking too much in her GREEK MYTH comic. also he doesn't even have three heads most of the time? that's his one defining trait besides being scary and still rachel fucked that up. it's so annoying she can't even be bothered to keep basic things correct while still claiming to be an expert.
3. ngl im happy rachel cut out the erotes. just off her depiction of eros she still has very bad ideas about LGBT+ representation (seriously the gay best friend trope post 2013? with eros being obsessed with a woman and the only hint he's bi being a cut scene? wow) so her trying to cover the god of homosexual love, the god who was made via the love of two men, or the deity of intersex/being non gender conforming would be more than awful. they deserve to not be in this heterosexual mess.
4. webtoons promote anyone other than LO and give them the massive marketing campaigns, financial backing, and extra resources and deals RS gets challenge (Impossible)
5. tbh i dont think the height difference is particularly bad (ive shipped couples with even more of a difference) i think it's more the combination of how young she is (and how the comic keeps bringing up its weird but then being like ok now forget about it??), her childish personality ,and the overemphasis on hades' power and experience over her that it becomes an issue. if she was a confident, sexually liberated 700 year old goddess who knew her worth the height difference wouldnt matter, IMHO.
6. see the romance in LO is off because rachel cannot help but make HxP the most powerful, desired, amazing etc characters in the whole story, yet at the same time wants us to pity them and feel like he "deserves" they each other to be happy because she insists they're the "real underdogs" like??? neither LO H or P have any disadvantages, flaws, or conflicts to make them not be together so rachel insisting they're this tragic romance is just like no?? they're just not acting like normal people??
7. All this talk about Hera entering a relationship with Echo really shows how blind Rachel must be to problems in the ships she sets up. As some one mentioned earlier, it’s a rehash of a boss lusting over a worker. But like, Hera also pretty often talks about how lowly she think of nymphs. So not only would she be with a worker, but a worker from a race she actively believes is below her. If this was like a commentary on how Hera isn’t actually that different from Zeus then that’d actually be really interesting, but if she did this, it would only be to girlboss Hera. What a mess
8. i've seen some defenders say "oh there's only critique of LO now that it's popular" like?? no there were people calling it out when it was on discover and rachel was just some tumblr nobody. critique has only picked up more and more over the years because its just that more known and the issues are only getting worse and piling up, not some hate over popularity? im sure there is some critique over that but most of the critiques has been here for /years/, not only in the last few months.
9. ive actually seen some lo stans defend the age gap AS the modern aspect because "age gap relationships are more common now" which 1) no theyre not, and 2) what 19 year old is hooking up with a 2000+ year old man?? like MAYBE if he was actually 45 like he's "mentally" supposed to be then ok MAYBE they have a point, but he's not?? hes literally supposed to be thousands of years older than her in every regard? like literally the argument makes no sense??
10. I feel like Persephone being older would actually be a much stronger point to the story than her being 19/20, and not just bc of the weird age gap. She could still have the same characterization and plot, but it would be better to aide in her frustration of being sheltered/desire to be taken seriously as a goddess and want her freedom, and to actually hammer home demeter's controlling ways, because as it stands now she just looks like an overdramatic, spoiled child with no perspective.
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lucky-sevens · 4 years
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so, you’ve heard about the mechanisms, but have no idea what they are or how to get into them?
the mechanisms are a steampunk folk concept band! if you’re familiar with the decemberists, some of the stuff david bowie has done, or steam powered giraffe, it’s a bit like that- each album tells a story! (the albums are all tragic space operas, with the added bonus of being very queer!)
the bit where it starts to get complicated is the band itself. they’re all playing characters, and they do their shows in character! so, basically, the narration on the albums isn’t omniscient- it’s being narrated by the mechanisms, who have opinions about the story and tend to get involved in it at some point. to differentiate them from the actual band, i’m going to refer to them as ‘the crew of the aurora’!
further details under the cut! (edit: added some links!)
the albums
they have 4 main albums, which you can listen to on spotify, bandcamp and youtube! just look them up, there's a youtube account called TheVoidSings that does lyric videos + album playlists, as well as the mechanisms official account! in addition, they are all linked at the end of this post.
(note: the albums are all tragedies, and there’s some pretty intense stuff that can happen- i wouldn’t let that steer you away from it as they are very good and well done, but if you tend to like lighter or happier stories, be a bit careful going in? a lot of queer characters tend to die- because 1. everyone dies and 2. everyone is queer- which, while it’s not bury your gays, i know some people like to avoid.)
album descriptions
-once upon a time (in space)- based on european fairy tales! stars snow white and her attempt to rebel against the evil king cole and his intergalactic empire and rescue her sister, rose red! also has a lesbian romance at the center! 
-ulysses dies at dawn- based on greek mythology! stars four 'suitors'- orpheus, oedipus, ariadne, and hercules- trying to break into ulysses/odysseus' secret vault on a job for the olympians, an elite mob family with a stranglehold over the planet it takes place on 
-high noon over camelot- a steampunk western based on arthurian legend! features poly arthur, guinevere, and lancelot on a quest for the G.R.A.I.L, the control center of the abandoned space station they're trapped on 
-the bifrost incident- based on norse mythology! a locked room mystery around what happened to the ratatosk express, a train that disappeared eighty years ago with all of the asgardian ruling class on board. this album is also rock, versus the earlier ones which were folkpunk. 
you can listen to them in any order (i've summarized them in order of release), but you should listen to the album of your choice in order/all the way through! (my personal favorite is high noon over camelot!)
the crew
the crew of the aurora is a group of nine queer space pirates! they’re all immortal, mostly because of dr carmilla, a morally ambiguous, very lonely lesbian vampire who has a slight problem with experimenting on dying children. they all have a mechanical part of some kind- for example, ashes o’reilly has mechanical lungs, because they originally died from smoke inhalation. that part is called their mechanism, and it’s what’s keeping them immortal! (also, their immortality works by having them come back from death, rather than being unable to be harmed. this can result in them doing really stupid shit, dying, and then just coming back. they murder each other a lot to bond) there’s a lot of found family vibes, which is quite nice! in general, despite being tragic figures themself, they add an air of humor to the albums with their banter and the like!
each of the crew has their own backstory, mostly from quite different genres! if you’d like a fairly comprehensive version of all their backstory songs, i’d recommend this recorded show and if you’d like just an assessment of their general vibes/a good intro to everything, i’d suggest looking up ‘the ignomious demise of dr plitchard’ (one of their stand-alone songs)
bonus content
recorded gigs- there are quite a few out there, and i’d highly recommend listening to them, because the shows were the original way the media was supposed to be! there’s a ton of in character banter, they’re all in costume, all that! 
death to the mechanisms- the mechanisms’ last show! it has a very bittersweet vibe, but there’s also incredible lighting, as well as proper recordings of tales to be told and drunk space pirate (the songs they play at the beginning and end of each show!) there’s also a lot of lore there that’s nice to know, including what it says on the tin: how they all, eventually, die. note- there’s a stream and an audio version. the stream is choppy and cuts out a lot, and the audio version is nice and clean, but the stream is still nice to watch because of the lighting and the visual jokes.
tales to be told volumes one and two- compilations of all their standalone songs! some of them fit with albums, and some of them are their own retellings that work on their own! this is also where all the backstory songs are compiled, though i’d recommend watching the recorded show i linked instead as that has the relevant exposition. 
frankenstein- a standalone, 10 minute album on youtube about the story of victoria frankenstein and the rogue ai she created.
dr. carmilla albums (exhumed and [un]plugged + ageha prototype edition, available on bandcamp)- songs telling the backstory of doctor carmilla, the mechanisms’ creator! they’re in a different style than the rest- think girl in red. lots of yearning lesbian music vibes. 
mechanisms fiction- this is on their website! has a lot of very interesting lore and character things, and i’d highly recommend reading all of it! it’s also very well written. personally, i’d recommend ulysses and narcissus go to the seaside, the quickest draw, archive footage, and bedtime story for the writing, and ever after, the story of the toy soldier, who killed dr carmilla, and ghost in the machine for lore!
resources
links to almost all the mechanisms content out there!
album links
once upon a time in space- spotify/bandcamp/youtube
ulysses dies at dawn- spotify/bandcamp/youtube
high noon over camelot- spotify/bandcamp/youtube
the bifrost incident- spotify/bandcamp/youtube
bonus content
tales to be told, volume 1- spotify/bandcamp/youtube
tales to be told, volume 2- spotify/bandcamp/youtube
frankenstein- spotify/bandcamp/youtube
mechanisms ‘supplementals’ (songs not in the albums, alternative versions, etc)- youtube
exhumed and (un)plugged- bandcamp/youtube
ageha (prototype edition)- bandcamp/youtube
mechanisms fiction
additional short story
tumblr (mostly an inactive blog for the band to post about shows they were doing, but features some in-character posts)
twitter (ditto)
---
gig compilation post
fiction compilation post
blog compilation post
deep lore post
fanfiction recommendations list
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helisol · 3 years
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dude im not sure you will get it after reading this either, but you Can read it now
okay so first of all do not expect me to adhere to rules of grammar or Proper capitalisation, I am writing from the heart
so it’s been said before by other people but if Quark and Odo didnt look like the aliens that they are but instead like two regular prettybois the fandom would do cartwheels over their dynamic and Not call them a crack ship. because really, their dynamic fucking SLAPS and I’m here to tell you Why.
their surface-level dynamic is “Respected and Talented Security Chief and Cunning Immoral Businessman who are in Love but pretend not to be” and that's just an off-brand version of enemies to lovers! which is excellent and for some people that’s all you really need to get invested in a ship.
but some people look at it and go “Hm, no, that’s not enough. I mean, they work as friends but it doesn’t really have to be romantic.” and to that I say you are Absolutely Valid, not everything has to be romantic.
it just so happens that these two fuckers have one of the most compelling romance stories ever, and it’d be a shame not to explore it.
so before I dive into the internalised homophobia and repression, I’d like to take a moment to talk about Quark as a character.
because if you have brainworms like me you can kind of see that its an honest to god greek tragedy.
this guy comes from a race of people where being kind, ethical and fair is considered Abnormal and Horrifying. and I’m not gonna call Quark out of all people kind, ethical or fair but,,, 
you ever notice how he’s A Much Better Person Than Pretty Much All Other Ferengi?
dont get me wrong, Quark is still a bastard, but every once in a while his True Character shines through. and I say True Character because guys,,, the way he behaves around other people is an Act. he’s pretending to be something he’s not.
he has to try so hard to be a good ferengi it’s honestly painful to watch at times. because he is a SHIT ferengi! 
he loves his friends- because that's what the ds9 crew are. they’re his friends! and it makes him miserable because that's not! normal! for a ferengi!
let’s compare Quark and Rom for a second. 
Quark reeks of self loathing because a lot of the time he just Doesn’t act like a ferengi is supposed to, and this drives a lot of conflict in the show. he knows how a ferengi should act, it’s just that he can’t!! fucking!! do it!! but he still tries and tries to fit into that mold, which straight up ruins his life on multiple occasions.
Rom is also not a Model Ferengi, but he lives without hating himself. and it’s mostly because he doesn’t care about how a ferengi Should act, he’s loved and cared for even when everybody knows that he’s a shit ferengi! because his non-ferengi-ness works to his benefit. it encourages and highlights his abilities as an engineer. the success and love he finds make it easy for him to be content with his true self. Unlike Quark, who doesn’t get unconditional love from anyone.
its so!! tragic!! because you can see what Quark is really like!! his true self!! he’s a nice guy who cares for people!
its right there all the time and it's so blatantly obvious. especially in episodes like “Body Parts”, “Bar Association”, “The Way Of The Warrior” and “Ferengi Love Songs”
his own wiki page literally calls him “a compassionate and generous man by ferengi standards” which pretty much translates to “not really a good ferengi”.
anyway so Quark is a tragic figure or whatever but we’re actually here for the REPRESSED! HOMOSEXUAL! TENDENCIES! that he and Odo both exhibit.
with characters like garak you don’t really need to have brainrot to pick up on those tendencies, because that was something andrew robinson chose to do, on purpose. 
and to be fair, Quark wasn’t intended to be Any kind of representation, not even by the actor. I’m just pointing out that he Does look and act and talk like a little gayman.
I will admit that he is Painfully Straight in the text of the show, but on a meta level he’s just. a dude who has a serious case of repressing his real personality. and taking it a step further- he also represses his feelings towards another man.
and that man is Odo.
a few things on him:
Odo is literally desperate to be a person. unlike Quark, who at least has the comfort of belonging to a society of people with a set of rules and expectations, Odo has never met anyone or anything like him in all his years of life.
like, we all know Odo basically grew up in a lab, right? 
with people who didn’t know anything about him. who he was so unalike that they literally called him “Nothing”
but he still learned to look and talk and act like them (because if he didn’t he’d feel *pain* which is very fucked up by the way?)
so we know for a fact that Odo wants to be recognised as a person- which is why he tries really hard to conform to the ideals of the society that raised him. instead of exploring his nature as a shape shifter he maintains a humanoid form, picks up a job and creates an entire personality around what he wants to be seen as. but not what he really is.
and that's the thing that causes all the conflict between Quark and Odo. the type of person odo wants to be seen as is the polar opposite of whatever the fuck quark wants to be seen as.
In the same way that Quark acts like a Normal Ferengi, Odo acts like a Normal Security Officer.  and in a cruel twist of fate, the Ferengi happens to be the antithesis of the Security Officer.
If you only look at them as the things they act like, and not the things they are, you might say they’re way too different to like each other, right? 
but,,, if you think about the fact that they’re both putting on this act,,, this performance of idealised versions of themselves,,, you can see that they are The Same. They Are Both Gay Repressed Loser Aliens Who Try To Act Like Things That They Aren’t!
Imagine you’re Odo. 
Imagine that you’re Nothing, because you’re not like anything anyone has ever seen- and because you are Nothing you don’t fall in love with anyone for years and years. since who could love something that isn’t like them at all?
But then one day this Thing shows up in your path and you just hate it. Because it’s not like anything *you* have ever seen. It’s disorderly and looks grotesque and it’s criminal to boot.
It’s all the things you learned would make a “Bad Person” It’s everything you aspire not to be, because if you were any of those things you would BE PUNISHED.
But the trouble is, eventually he’s not an “it” anymore, he’s “Quark” and you see him every day of your miserable little life because you live on the same damn station in space and it’s hard to avoid each other.
He also happens to be one of the only things in your life that are constant. He will never leave because he is stubborn and greedy and you just *hate him so much* that you’re convinced he must be doing all of it to spite you. And yet you also can’t seem to leave him alone.
So Odo Must Hate Quark. everything else is a non sequitur for him. he can’t not hate Quark.
because Quark is, and i’m sincerely sorry to apply christian fucking imagery to this, The Forbidden Fruit.
If he liked quark he’d admit some kind of moral failing. it would be the end of his act. but on the other hand...it might be a good thing, because at least he could have quark.
but Odo can never go through with biting into this apple because the consequences are horrifying to him. he could never have quark because, according to his performance, he would Never like quark to begin with.
and here’s a take for you: Odo's Brand Of Internalised Homophobia Doesn't Stem From Heteronormativity. It Stems From The Fact That He Was Kind Of Assigned Asexual At Birth.
and the show sort of alludes to this, for real! not just subtext! canon! except the writers used the wrong person. 
because instead of Odo having these Forbidden Feelings for Quark he has them for,,, Kira.
but since this is My Quodo Manifesto you’ll understand that i am 100% willing to just toss that part of canon out the airlock.
so Odo does canonically have that mindset of “no one could ever love me”  for decades he repressed any and all feelings of love to avoid getting hurt. in the show he breaks this cycle of repression when he takes a chance and enters a relationship with Kira. yay?
but we all know that aint it chief. and part of the reason why That Ship Ain’t It is the fact that Quark is Right There. and he is simply the more interesting choice for odo.
he and Odo literally share the same problem and have weird intertwined character arcs! they are both dreadfully afraid of not conforming to the ideal versions of themselves, so they reject everything that could challenge their Performance!
on some fucked up level they hate each other *and* themselves individually. and this hatred makes them reject parts of their real identities for the sake of protecting their image. which. yknow. in gay people. is internalised homophobia!
so you can see that they’re both repressing A Lot even if you view them as Friends, but the most important thing in this kind of romantic dynamic is usually,,, when the characters *stop* repressing.
and the thing is. the thing that Kills Me with these two. They Never Get That Moment. Thats Why You Need The Brainrot To See Them As Romantic.
The Ascent gives us an example of what happens when they both take their act too far. I mean, who could forget “Fascist!” and “Fraud!” That is what odo thinks of quark’s performance and vice versa, but we don’t really hear them adress the fact that they *are* playing these roles to a ridiculous extent.
We also never get an example of what would happen if they dropped their act instead of over-performing it. or rather we don’t get to see both of them drop it.
And the reason why we never get that moment is because there’s this one key difference between Quark and Odo. 
Quark knows that he’s constantly repressing his true nature and his feelings for odo. We pretty much hear him say so in the iconic root beer scene in Way Of The Warrior. he knows that he’s not a good ferengi but he keeps up his act.
So quark is aware enough to feel that sweet sweet self loathing. But Odo isnt self loathing as much as he is just self sabotaging.
and this subtle difference between them is why, at the very end of the show, we get “That man loves me, can’t you see? It was written all over his back!”
this moment is quark dropping his act and asking odo to do the same. he wants to hear a genuine Goodbye from him because they have known each other for Decades and they are Friends. but odo is so unable to express the feelings he’s been repressing all these years. that he self sabotages again and just walks away.
even though this is like. very anticlimactic. considering I just spent 2000 words talking about how Odo and Quark are Most Certainly Gay For Each Other.
The fact that their ending is so Weird is the reason why quodo is so engaging and appealing to me? especially post-canon quodo.
like, the amount of “what if’s” this ship has are Astounding.
What if either of them had dropped their act a little sooner? What if they both did, for just a moment, and it was the straw that breaks the camels back?
What if Odo comes back after a few years? What if Quark comes to get him?
What if, in that moment in the finale where Quark drops his act, Odo had returned the gesture? What if Gag-Reel Quodo Kiss.gif Real?
with the depth that I read into their relationship, those what ifs are really fun to think about.
anyway its 1 am and i’m not an english major so literary analysis is not like, my strong suit. plus most of this was written in a late night screaming session with a friend who has the exact same opinions as me. i just think aliens hot and in love. thats all.
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itonje · 3 years
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I'm not a fan of Miller's book, either. Seriously, what is it with writers pinning women against each other? It's even more confusing when it's a female writer doing it.
If it was just Perse and Pasipäe, okay. If you want to give Circe a bad home life, fine. But Miller does it constantly. Athena was done especially dirty imo. I know she can be pretty petty herself (ex: Arachne, and even then, the reason for turning her into a spider tends to vary), but the way she was portrayed was just so grating. So eager for a champion, I was almost convinced Miller had conflated her with Ares. I don't think the exiled nymphs are even given names, let alone distinguishing personalities, and can we stop dunking on Helen? The Iliad makes it pretty clear that she loved Menelaus and didn't think highly of Paris.
And tbh, the story kinda felt a little repetitive at times, too: Circe meets someone, they get mad at her or leave her, she'll occasionally sleep with someone, rinse and repeat. And granted, she's a pretty minor character in the myths already, but I feel like it would've benefited the story more if she had been given more freedom, that she wasn't restricted to just her island. At the very least, how awesome it would've been if Circe had essentially started her own coven before passing on the role as the head witch of Aiaia to Penelope.
Also, can we stop having sexual assault scenes if the story isn't about that? At least it gives Circe a reason to turn men into literal pigs, but still.
I also don't think it's ever really explained why Circe has a mortal voice, even though she has full Titan blood. She just does. Granted, Perse is a minor nymph, but then what about the rest of her children? I'd get it if it was meant to be an allegory for disabilities, but it just felt like it was added on for the sake of making Circe more of an outcast than she already was.
And this is really more of a nitpick, but for a book that focuses so heavily on witchcraft, it's strange that Hecate wasn't even mentioned. In some versions, she's even Circe's mother. It's also really weird how homosexuality seems to be something that was so uncommon in Ancient Greece as far as these books are concerned, even though we know from history and myth that it wasn't. So yeah, Circe x Penelope would've been pretty awesome!
Blegh, sorry for the rant! I just have alot of thoughts about this book right now! ^^"
ATHENA WAS DONE SO SO DIRTY...it makes no sense even in the telegony itself its her who urges circe to tell telegonus about odyessus. wouldn't it have been more interesting for athena to assist circe in raising telegonus? wouldn't it have been more tragic for telegonus to go kill odyessus at athena's urging of him to go meet him? and then yadda yadda athena and circe can have a falling out then or something yadda yadda i don't know again, i know the gods are written in very specific ways here for the ultimate theme of the book here but like this book is so hard on athena it's so weird when i think that honestly there could have been more interesting for her and circe to work together...
ALSO YEAH MADELINE MILLER HAS A HELEN PROBLEM...i think it was fairer in the song of achilles and i rationalized the helen weirdness in that one by going 'well they're achilles and patroclus of course they won't have choice opinions on helen if from their perspective she's the one that led them into this war' but come on..not in circe too..leave her alone...
and i agree the book really did feel repetitive, but if you're asking me i wish there was more exploration to the episodes circe does get-especially the stint at crete, i wish we had seen more of circe and ariadne's and even her and pasiphae's relationship so bad. they get one conversation where they talk and it was so good but it ends so soon. honestly i feel a lot of the conversations in the book are repetitive as well- someone talking to someone, they reveal something about something else, the first someone is surprised!
also yeah the assault is um. i did not think we needed that scene as explicit as it was but i get that that's routine in these sorts of books at this point...now i will say i don't think a book has to be about that sort of stuff if a book includes them but i do think it should be addressed with care and i dunno if that book does that....
ALSO YEAH...the mortal's voice thing is an epithet given to her in the odyssey without much preamble as to what implications that has or to where she got it from and i don't think the author really had to explain it to make the story work but it would...have been nice to see her come up with an interpretation of what exactly that means for circe
and no i don't think it's a nitpick, i feel the same way irt to the book and witchcraft but the witch i feel like got REALLY shifted was medea. i think there could have been sooo many good parallels with medea and circe here-while circe is hated by her divine family, medea is a darling of helios (and in a fair amount of medea myths she returns to colchis where she's presumably forgiven by aeetes, including that variant where she kills perses to reinstate her father on the throne. i wish that had been mentioned in circe; at least then perses would have a point). while circe becomes a mortal at the end of her story in circe, medea in euripides' medea becomes a goddess herself or close to it while also becoming more monstrous in the process. while circe is constantly accused of caring too much for mortals medea has a fair disregard for the lives of other people (maybe due to her powers to reverse mortality). there could have literally been so much said here not just about divinity and mortality but the boundaries that both circe and medea would cross for the sake of their love oh my god i have no idea why not only her episode in the book was so short but there was very little follow up to what happened with her story afterward ugauwerwherhe
also yeah irt to homosexuality i think it was implied? telegonus was gay which is chill but also come on...give us the iconic greek myth ladies wlw romances.....
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