“No, if you have ever loved me-

-don’t do this.”

so the writers can give l*andrin random subplots and make up scenes for her that include taking scenes from siuan and twisting them, just to make her 'sympathetic' when she works for the dark one and literally sells girls into slavery, but they have to write siuan doing the most out of character shit I see how it is

I read TSR chapter 47 and now I am so deep in Siuan feels and I don't know what to do. just go to sleep I guess??? or write angsty fanfiction that may or may not involve a new cursed ship idea

Hear me out, did Siuan know Moiraine was for sure going to be Compulsed by the command?

Because if she swore Darkfriend oaths in the last six months, it wouldn’t have worked: all four previous Oaths would be removed.

But, in her mind she thinks Moiraine has lied which at least removes the Three Oaths. Since the fourth Oath held, that means Moiraine swore to the dark sometime in between the Three and the fourth. Which means Moiraine was a Darkfriend when she swore to honor and obey Siuan Sanche.

wtf hahahahahha

30 pages into my Fires of Heaven reread and Elaida thinks about how Shemerin is weak cause she has anxiety and should be made an example of because of that and scolds an Accepted for having a stutter and telling her to "speak properly." fuck you, Elaida

amol spoilers about siuan//

The most offensive thing to come out of amol is siuan sanche being killed off-screen while trying to rescue a ta'veren and min ending up saving mat instead with perfectly aimed knife throws when mat is Lucky and better at using his knives.

She's not even done the courtesy of receiving a heroic death when she and moiraine are responsible for kicking off the search for the dragon reborn and guiding him and egwene - they end up becoming the two most powerful characters in the series! Even gawyn receives a better death than she does. Ugh.

🍊The Tar Valon Tangerines: Part III

bonus:

Hi! I'm the anon who asked about Moirane and Siuan and I'm crying so much, I never expected you would be so incredibly awesome and kind with your reply. I was honestly shocked by it and I literally have no words to thank you for all the time and effort that must have taken. I was expecting a short and simple "They interact two more times and never see each other again" or something like that at most but you went so far with it and it seriously means the world to me. I also absolutely loved your funny comments, you had me laughing in many parts.

And yeah, that's actually why I couldn't find anything explicit about what happened to them, I didn't exactly know what to look for, their wiki pages barely mention their relationship to each other outside of New Spring and I've seen some tumblr posts but they're not specific. Some mentioned Moiraine dying, Siaun dying, them never speaking again but implying it ended on bad terms or that they just never cared about each other again after their last meeting so I was just getting more and more confused, that's why you even including moments when they thought about each other even after believing the other was death meant everything to me.

And you were right, learning more about it made me happy because of the knowledge and because of the affirmation that even after everything they still thought about each other and how this entire series basically started because of them (which makes it worse that they didn't have a proper culmination regarding that) but it also made me so sad and even more mad.

One of the things that surprised the most was what happened to Siaun, I've read many fans say that while they don't care about Thom that much, they do love Garrett and his relationship with Siaun so imagine my surprise when I read that he was an old man infatuated with his "almost teenage slave". How can anyine love that? There is no context or excuse that would make that entire relationship better in my eyes, I'm so shocked. And the way she changed I just can't believe it. Of course so far my take of Siaun comes from Sophie's interpretation so I can't, in no way, imagine that woman that I met in episode 6 behaving like you just described. It's so absolutely awful and wrong, he created an entire different character and said it was Siaun! I'm absolutely shocked.

And Moiraine's story got no better either. I knew she and Siaun weren't really gonna have a happy ending, definitely not together, but I had NO IDEA the Lan/Moiraine beautiful platonic relationship would also be ruined. Again, I just know them from what I've seen on the show so I can't even begin to comprehend a world were Moiraine is believed dead for a long time, then comes back and her and Lan don't try to at least fix their relationship. I know the Warder thing is complicated but I always liked to believed that their love for each other was more than just the bond, that they really loved and cared about each other as friends, so I'm really sad about that just being destroyed.

I'm really sad that Siuan had the opposite of character growth for the most part and then had an awful ending that wasn't even an important part of the story and that Moiraine ended without the people she loved the most, with a guy that didn't respect her. That was also shocking, I can't believe the Moiraine I got to know would not only marry a man intimidated or threatened by her power but that she would tell him she would renounce her power for him. I just can't imagine that ever coming out of her mouth. I know she changed and suffered and stuff but it doesn't make sense.

I'm not from the USA and finding the books is a bit hard here but I found a way to buy New Spring online so I got that one and I will definitely read it! The little bits you wrote about it had me squealing and hugging my pillow because of the cuteness and gayness and just knowing that it focuses on my two best girls and Lan made me instantly get it. I will just try and pretend their ending was different though lol I know fans of book series hate changes, I get that in a way but hopefully some things do change in the show because I'm just no ready to accept some of the things I just read.

I know the story was never about Moiraine and Siuan, but knowing that they were meant to know each other, all thins that they accomplished together, both of them hearing that prophecy and starting this mission together, basically the whole plot of the book, for that to not have a real ending. Just using them to start the engine but then not having a good resolution about it? And I don't even mean a happy ending, but something!

There are so many more things I could say and I have so many opinions about this and I'm still in awe that you took the time to do this but I'm not gonna make this longer than it needs to be and bore you even more, you already did too much for me and I will absolutely treasure everything you wrote and I will save it so I can read it many more times.

Thank you so much for everything, I hope you have the nicest of days!

Spoilers for the entire Wheel of Time book series

You're quite welcome. I hope you enjoy New Spring! However, I feel dutybound to warn you that there's triggering content in the book.

(TW for grooming: In New Spring, Lan has interactions with a woman who basically groomed him when he was a child. The narrative tries to pass it off as a Malkieri cultural thing, but. It. Is. Grooming. So go in forewarned.)

I've read many fans say that while they don't care about Thom that much, they do love Garrett and his relationship with Siaun so imagine my surprise when I read that he was an old man infatuated with his "almost teenage slave". How can anyine love that?

(I hate defending Gareth Bryne but i feel honourbound to clarify: he only thinks Siuan is ~18 when he begins to chase her down. When he finds her and realizes who she really is - the deposed Amyrlin - he realizes she's 42 years old, and is still utterly infatuated with her, so it becomes un-creepy at that point. Again, I HATE having to defend this man but he's meeting the very low bar here.)

I presume it's easier for some people to find Gareth/Siuan romantic than Thom/Moiraine because if you're not thinking too hard about it, the barebones of Gareth/Siuan fits certain romantic tropes that were popular in the 90s and early 2000s (a highly decorated lord/general falling in love with a commonborn fisherman's daughter when she's lost all her power, a highly ambitious woman finding that what she actually values is romantic love above all else, the whole servant-master dynamic, etc). Everyone can ship whatever they want, but I will never see eye-to-eye with people who find it romantic, and I personally want to beat Gareth Bryne to death with my bare hands for what his introduction into the narrative does to Siuan's arc and personality.

Of course so far my take of Siaun comes from Sophie's interpretation

IMO Sophie is a perfect Siuan, I really can't see anyone else in that role anymore and I feel like she really gets across the complex and seemingly contradictory facets that make up Siuan's personality in the books perfectly - and she's why I hate Siuan's character deterioration in the later books even more now than before I watched the show, because imagine Sophie!Siuan putting up with any of that, LMAO.

but I had NO IDEA the Lan/Moiraine beautiful platonic relationship would also be ruined

Yeah. Sorry. i don't have even snippets to comfort with you here but the good news is the show most likely won't treat their relationship as something to be discarded by the wayside. IIRC, Rafe Judkins - the WoT showrunner - got a huge binder from amazon of fans' opinions on what they want improved from the books to the show, and one of those was fans asking for a proper resolution/interactions for them. so like. have hope.

Enjoy New Spring!

Thinking about how WoT #6 makes it really clear what Aes Sedai think of women who've been stilled. The aversion, the fear, the disgust and near-reproachful attitude. Thinking of how show!Moiraine likely worried about this at least subconsciously in regards to Siuan after being shielded. Thinking of Moiraine trying desperately to hold onto her conviction as she soldiers forward in her mission, all the while cringing hopelessly away from the idea of Siuan looking at her differently now that her powers are gone. Wondering if the absence of that commonality would change the way Siuan spoke to her, respected her, loved her. Thinking of how carefully Siuan handles it once Lan tells her, how nimbly she tries to step around the pain she knows rips Moiraine apart. How gently she tries to shoulder Moiraine's burden, how willing she is to do whatever it takes to protect their mission and protect Moiraine too. Thinking about how all this goes unsaid yet is so, so clear because Rosamund and Sophie are fucking goddesses

I think the reason I don't buy the argument that the show is framing Siuan as a villain/antagonist is that, while some of her actions are morally questionable (as are the actions of many of the characters in the show and books- including Moiraine and Rand in this episode) the merits of what she is saying are completely reasonable.

Cause the thing is, Siuan is right: Moiraine has lost control of the situation, and she no longer has the ability to be a check on Rand if he goes mad or becomes a threat to the world, much less protect him from the Forsaken. Meanwhile Rand, who should be out fulfilling prophecies, gathering nations and peoples behind him, fighting the Forsaken and rallying the world, has spent six months doing fuck all in Cairhien. He certainly has not been working to learn to control the One Power, which is the reason Moiraine lured him to Cairhien in the first place. Instead he's crept closer to either the One Power killing him from his failure to control it, or else going mad from using it.

Is taking him into custody and putting the Tower's leash on him the right move, morally? Maybe or maybe not, it depends on what you believe. Is it something that makes a disturbing amount of sense to an increasingly desperate Siuan? Well she says it herself in The Shadow Rising: Rand will full fill no prophecies dead. At least in the Tower he will be safe from the Forsaken and at least shielded the possibility of him killing himself on accident with the One Power is eliminated.

Is calling Lanfear for a save a morally right response for Moiraine and RAnd? Maybe and maybe not- the Foregaters and other innocents slaughtered by Lanfear's rampage would probably argue no, not moral, but Moiraine would likely argue yes, because it was necessary in order to free Rand so he could save the world. Was it in character for both of them? Definitely yes, given how desperate they are, and how rapidly the stakes are rising for Rand personally, and the world more generally.

Is Siuan using the Oath to force Moiraine to seal the Waygate a morally right thing? Probably not. Does it make sense when one of the Forsaken has attacked the city conveniently giving Rand the chance to escape right as Moiraine has abruptly and mysteriously regained her ability to channel? Absolutely.

The price of the small pleasures

Alanna's character feels like a needed contrast that helps shape the perception of Moiraine's character. There is this whole episode where it's all about family and home. Alanna comes back home with a huge family, the kids are having fun, laughing, and playing with her Warders, it's warm, sunny, and cozy, a beautiful nature around, with lots of food as usual. Alanna is open, speaking with everyone, and making jokes. Life is good and people seem happy. Alanna is never alone and it looks like she is often home, where she is accepted and loved. And then there is Moiraine. Oh, boy... It's almost hilarious if it wasn't so fucking depressing.

This one comes back to her huge house, dark and gloomy even during the day, and revisits her memories, but it doesn't seem happy. It looks like a museum of someone long dead. Her things are covered, someone is keeping her room, all her things, but she is never home. She barely says two words to her sister and immediately they have a fight. And I get it - Moiraine is not exactly pleasant in her behaviour, even though she has her reasons. But she refuses tea. TEA! Alanna is cooking, having full meals, and enjoying life, and Moiraine refuses even that small pleasure. And tea is one of the few things Moiraine loves. It's almost as if she deprives herself of every pleasure. And it's not like she can't spend 20 minutes with her sister and say at least a few nice words.

Moiraine doesn't eat. They make a point with that one. We never see her eat. Lan eats, Nynaeve eats, Alanna( almost all the time - she is green, after all), her warders, Lan, Thomas, Verin, and Adeleas is all about LET ME enjoy my meal and wine ( half of the time she is completely out and doesn't know what happens around her and the rest of the time she is horny (now that is not exactly true, but that is for later). Perin even eats. Egwene drinks with Elayne. Everyone at some point is shown to eat. Never Moiraine.

Food is not just necessary for survival. Food is also a pleasure. It should be a pleasure if done correctly. Meals also mean connection with other people. If and when Moiraine ever eats, she eats alone. She refuses to join the others in Verin's house, her sister, and she refuses the sandwiches of her nephew. They make yet another point of showing how isolated she is, even from people, who genuinely care about her.

The first time her sister is actually nice to her, her first reaction is to get defensive and snarky and, after a couple more words, Moiraine literally crumbles and starts to cry. This is the first time in months, after The Eye she shows emotion in front of someone. And it's almost forced, she is exhausted, and hasn't slept in... a while and someone basically reads her and finds exactly her weakness and confronts her about it. That is just for a moment and she composes herself immediately. Seconds later she gets help and she shows emotion again. It sort of seems like showing vulnerability and weakness, and asking for help is something that she has no right to do, or... I don't know.

The one time we saw her doing some for her own pleasure was Tar Valon. The tea and the spa. And Siuan. And this was it. Now it sort of feels like she is avoiding that on purpose. Either she thinks she doesn't deserve it or thinks that this is a distraction.

Her baths in Verin's house are more self-punishment than pleasure. She doesn't have to carry water alone, but she does it anyway. And something tells me that this well is probably not the only one around that house. Both women are Aes Sedai, which means they can use The One Power for ... a lot of things. They have a garden and a bunch of flowers in the house, that look pretty fresh and green for the Mediterranean climate, considering the grass around is dry. Usually, every house has a well or some source of water close by. Yet, milady goes to a well, that is so far from the house, that is practically useless. Good luck bringing enough water from there for all the needs in this house, but anyway. Even with nothing to carry, in this heat, a walk like that is, to put it mildly very unpleasant. With something that heavy to carry up that hill... I don't know.

The other thing is - small pleasures are distractions. The only time she actually sits in the company of the others in S2 is when they are on their way to Tar Valon. And that is because she doesn't have a choice. And something happens there, that I think she thinks is a mistake. A moment of distraction, a small weakness, that threatens to ruin her plan. She is having a conversation. That scene is brilliant! Subtle, well-written, and perfect and I watched it like probably 30 times so far but I was focused on the wrong thing. The night when Lan and Moiraine travel to Tar Valon, everyone is around the campfire. Moiraine is again standing at a distance, isolated from everyone else until Verin goes to her, reveals what she knows and basically tells her "You know what I am not promising anything, you just have to trust me." They cut to other things and when are back again Moiraine folds and decides to sit with them. What could go wrong? Adeleas is drunk again, floating on a pink cloud, imagining romantic stories, speaking of sex life, and trying to make Lan talk. She asks how Lan and Moiraine met. What follows in uncomfortable silence! None of them speaks, Lan seems uneasy, and Moiraine glares annoyed. She continues to avoid his eyes. Verin tries to help, by saying that it's late and they have to go to bed. Adeleas ignores her, in her drunken haze and blabbing some imagined overly sexualized story, which gets on Moiraine's nerves. She quickly interrupts Adeleas's idiotic monologue with the true story of their first meeting. Whether it is because she is already annoyed with Adeleas' behaviour toward Lan, or wants to save him from an uncomfortable moment, is irrelevant. Lan is surprised. Moiraine speaks! But what was meant to be just a way to make Adeleas shut up, turns into a sweet moment. Because this memory is precious for both of them. Lan smiles and joins the explanation, they look at each other, and she smiles too throughout the whole time she tells the story. It turns into a banter between two very close people. Bond, no Bond, at this moment it doesn't matter - they are in synch again. This is beyond sweet. They joke! hell, Moiraine jokes! This is what they look like. This is them. For one very small moment. Everyone laughs. And then, all of a sudden, with a serious voice, a laser-sharp focus, and a very sober-looking expression, Adeleas says her great line. "And that's when you knew. Any old Warder can save you from Trollocks, that right one can save you from yourself." Adeleas wasn't drunk at all. You can pretend to be drunk when you are sober, you can't act sober when you are drunk. It was a setup for Moiraine, to open up, to speak, and she knew exactly how to make her drop her defenses and finally speak to him. An attempt to make her get close to Lan again maybe? Lan was happy for sure. Moiraine though... is on the verge of tears.

She knows what her goal is with him. She knows what the plan is and that little moment was a failure. The small pleasure of this moment would probably cost her. In order for her plan to work, she has to be awful to Lan. One small distraction, and she falls back into her normal self. A tiny moment of happiness, a shared memory, and the old, cold, and sour Aes Sedai is a normal woman with feelings. The danger - Lan sees through her and never wants to leave her side which eventually will lead to his death. That's how much a moment of weakness might cost.

I’m still s h o o k that people do not see exactly what’s going on with Moiraine throughout s2 and people are dragging her and dismissing her without an ounce of empathy for what she’s been through, so I’m bringing the full character analysis for y’all (and my own sanity). So this is a big ol in defense of Moiraine (and Lan) rant, so if that’s not your thing, scroll down now. Here we go.

I just… The AUDACITY some people have to look at Moiraine and be angry and pissed off at how she acts in S2. To not feel any sympathy and empathy for her and the monumental weight she’s under every goddamn day. There’s a reason we start with that bath scene in 2x01 – it shows you everything. How she’s just going through the motions. How she only lets herself cry when she’s alone in the water. How she literally curls into the fetal position and looks reproachfully devastated over her knees as she hugs them to her chest in a futile attempt at comfort. Not to mention the direct comparison/callback with the bath scene in 1x01, where she has both her power and Lan still, and now she’s lost her connection to both of them.

How is it not painfully obvious that every interaction she has after that bath scene is infused with a trauma response? Let’s tally up the devastation she’s been through. At the end of S1, she was 1. banished from the sisterhood of the white tower (they literally turned their backs on her), 2. was separated AGAIN from the love of her life fully expecting to never see her again, 3. was cut off from the other love of her life (that would be Lan, for the record) which is all the worse bc it’s her own fault for masking the bond, 4. was fully made to believe she’s been stilled from the one power aka an integral part of her being, AND 5. she’s “failed” her mission at the eye of the world – the one goal she’s had for the last 20 years, her life’s purpose – because instead of locking away the dark one she’s directly caused Rand to set Ishamael free.

You don’t think it's justified to be a little pissed off and standoffish after all of that? You don’t think the weight of that guilt, grief, pain, and loss is a reasonable cause to be distant, cold, harsh, having a little bit of a death wish? That’s TRAUMA, baby! She is absolutely wrecked, and it’s coming out in the worst way in her interactions with others (especially Lan because we’ve seen how they should be), but it’s absolutely not because she actively wants to hurt the people around her. In fact after almost every moment she lashes out at someone, we see an equally sad/grief-stricken/devastated moment from her and THAT’S the real emotion hiding underneath the anger. This woman needs therapy and understanding and patience, and does not deserve to be judged at the worst time of her life.

Ok fine, you say, but Lan IS patient and understanding with her! And she’s still an asshole to him! You’re right, Lan is absolutely trying his best and doing just about everything he can to be there for her in 2x01/2x02 (with a little help from Verin and Tomas). But 1. It’s STILL not about him, Moiraine is not obligated to respond in a certain way to her grief and pain that makes him feel better, and 2. This is Moiraine goddamn Damodred and even her trauma response is also a front to protect him, to push him away from her and what is now certainly a suicide mission to fight the dark without her powers.

This is SOOO important to really get Moiraine’s character — y’all gotta understand this: Moiraine truly loves only TWO people on the whole fucking planet: Siuan and Lan. They are also the only people who truly love her, unconditionally, with all of her flaws and imperfections. Please please ingrain that into your brain, especially for Lan, in this context. (Siuan is a whole other conversation I won’t get into at the moment.) Moiraine loves Lan, he loves her, deeply. That’s the foundation of everything they go through with each other in this season, despite what’s happening on the surface.

Once you accept that as fundamental truth, everything makes a whole lot more sense. She is a dick to him to push him away. Literally tells him he failed her to put the final nail in the coffin of driving him away, which is his worst nightmare. On the surface it seems egotistic at best, plain cruel at worst. But look underneath. Moiraine always has reasons 2, 3, 6 layers deep for everything she does.

With everyone else she’s mean to this season, namely her sister and her nephew, it’s born out of distrust (and the aforementioned trauma response). She can’t afford to trust anyone because anyone could be a dark friend. (And if they’re not a dark friend, then they become a liability and endangered.) Anything she lets slip could be used to hurt/control Rand and push them all one step closer to eternal darkness. Oh and when we see Barthanes’ true nature that turns out to be fucking justified, by the way. But I digress.

Right so why is she an asshole to Lan then? Because she doesn’t trust him? I don’t believe that for a second. These two have been on the same page, literally sharing the same headspace, for the last 20 years – she knows he’s the best person she’s ever met, the least likely to ever turn to the dark, ever. It’s an actual impossibility. So it’s not that she doesn’t trust him. She literally marvels at how courageous he must be to fight the dark with only a sword.

The true reason is: she does trust him, she does love him, and she KNOWS him. She knows that he will never leave her like this, in her darkest hour. He is both honor-bound to her (which he takes very seriously) and deeply cares for her. The problem is that now his life is in serious danger by staying with her. But there is no calmly explaining to him that he should return to the white tower for his own good and bond to another aes sedai who can actually channel, who can actually hold up her end of the partnership and protect him and heal him in return for his loyalty and sacrifice. Or better yet, find Nynaeve, who is not only ridiculously powerful and has probably the best chance of protecting him out of anyone, but who also loves him.

If Moiraine loves him and wants him safe, the ONLY option she has to protect him, the one good thing left in her life even if their bond is masked, is to drive him away. To make it so that he’ll stay far away from her of his own free will, and never come after her and her suicide mission to defeat the dark. Because she has already lost everything, she has no control over her fate anymore (if she ever had any to begin with), but the ONE thing she can still try to do is keep him safe. And hopefully, maybe he’ll be happy, one day. Her reasoning is directly confirmed for us in the last thing she says to him in 2x02 before she leaves: “Light protect you, al’Lan Mandragoran.” That was her goal all along, to protect him.

That’s the true reason she’s Like That to him. It’s all out of her love for him, and a desperate desire not to drag him down with her when she’s sure she’s destined to die on this mission. Is her strategy misguided? On the one hand yes, because she does need people to help her and she needs to trust someone, as he points out. On the other hand, she’s absolutely fucking right because look what happened with the Fade fight at the end of 2x01. Both her and Lan would have died without Verin and Tomas, and it would have been because she couldn’t channel. He is factually, logically, physically better off without her as long as she’s “stilled.”

This is why it makes sense how Lan eventually responds the way he does. He initially sees right through what she’s trying to do, he literally says he won’t let her push him away. He knows her too, better than anyone, including Siuan at this point. But he isn’t expecting her to go as far as she does, and it shakes him to his core. She tells him he failed her, has his worst fears confirmed, and then hears the words “we were never equals” and hears that she thinks she’s better than him, when she means the exact opposite. Tomas tells him to really listen but he can’t, in that moment.

But then he gets some distance, and some perspective thanks to Ihvon and Maksim, and he remembers: he loves her. He believes in her and he knows her and he knows what she’s doing to push him away (although maybe not why, when it comes to protecting him, because he doesn’t see himself as someone who needs protecting). Even better, he realizes that her situation is actually not what she thinks, that she’s shielded not stilled, and he can do something about that.

I LOVE Lan in 2x07 because he’s got Moiraine’s number now, and he will not be swayed by any further attempts (rather weak attempts at this point) to lash out at him. He just takes all the shit she throws at him, and calmly asks her what he needs to know and tells her what she needs to hear (“hopefully everything we’ve lost” and “that’s what I thought” and “you need to trust someone, Moiraine”), and is truthful with her even if she is still putting on this act with him in her fear and grief. He isn’t having any of it, he sees straight through it to the fear and pain underneath. And he literally DECIDES they are going to be okay, and then he fucking. Follows. Through.

He is not a doormat to her rage, he is not her servant, he’s not going back to her with his tail between his legs. He SHOWS UP for her in her darkest hour, when NO ONE, not even Siuan, can see what’s going on with her. That’s a true friend, a true hero, and absolute king behavior.

In conclusion, Moiraine’s behavior in s2, while not cute, is totally justified given the trauma, circumstances and everything she’s dealing with (jfc the lack of sleep alone) and makes sense in light of her ultimate goal to protect the world, which includes protecting Lan. And Lan’s response, once he figures out what to do, is the absolute correct way to handle the situation and is not weakness at all but strength in the highest order.

I’m so glad we got the payoff of all that with their conversation in 2x08 and reconnecting the bond. It was so beautiful, so earned, and reminded us of the level they’re on with each other — which is a soul connection way beyond what any of us can imagine.

This is coming from a show-only fan, but. Gotta say. I was having conniptions of delight over Siuan and Moraine in this episode. It is the BEST angst I have been served in forever. It is SO good. Don't know if this is "character murder" of Book!Siuan, but I for one find this characterization extremely compelling?

Because? She's doing exactly the same thing Moiraine is doing? Sacrificing everything she loves; and everyone she loves; for what she thinks is the only thing that matters, saving the world.

The only thing is that they disagree on how that must be done. Perfectly symmetrical opposites. Their lives and hearts ground to dust beneath the wheel.

The fucking. The fucking flashback flashes. When they were torn apart. I am dead? I have died. I have been murdered, and it felt so good.

Maybe this is a stretch driven by my hope for siuaraine, but I wonder if the final scene between Suian and Moiraine went the way it did because Suian thinks Moiraine might have turned to the dark

"You lied to me about being stilled."

My eyebrows shot up when I heard that line, bc that's a big deal accusation for an Aes Sedai. And parallels nicely with Alanna and co. accusing Lan of being a darkfriend last episode

Which I know some people hated, but the thing is, Lan and Moiraine have kind of been acting super sketchy, if you don't know the things we know

Like, from Siuan's pov: Lan shows up and tells her Moiraine has been stilled, which in MONTHS of letters, Moiraine never mentioned. Siuan is horrified that happened, has got to be terrified that Moiraine is going to kill herself, and is also lost and hurt and baffled that Moiraine would hide this from her

Like, that omission was a HUGE DEAL, relationship wise. Not a good move keeping something that important from your wife, especially when they were plotting together and it would be 100% reasonable and probably also a good move for Moiraine to turn to Siuan for help

And going back to Siuan's pov, she's dealing with ALL THAT, plus the Dragon, which is another thing she and Moiraine (seem to be?) at odds about

There's darkfriends in the Tower

Moiraine has been hiding something from her

Moiraine has been stilled

The town they're in is assaulted and set on fire

Someone has broken the Dragon out of the White Tower's custody

And when Siuan goes to try to, presumably, get him back, what happens?

She turns the corner and finds Moiraine, Lan, and Rand standing there, alone, in front of a waygate that MOIRAINE JUST OPENED

And I'm sure that normally, this wouldn't make Siuan worry about Moiraine's loyalties, but...she just found out the love of her life was stilled and then spent six months completely failing to tell her about it

Who wouldn't be shaken? Who wouldn't already be asking "If she hid something as big as THIS from me, what else could she be hiding?"

And then she shows up and Moiraine has just used the One Power to open a waygate

Earlier in the episode, when she finds out Moiraine has been stilled (well, close enough), what she says is something like "Six months of letters, and not a single word about that." The very common Aes Sedai route of lying by omission

When she shows up at the Waygate, she says "You lied to me about being stilled."

Siuan thinks Moiraine was able to break one of the oaths. Which Moiraine could only do if she'd sworn herself to the Dark.

And as Lan establishes, the idea of tying off a weave and leaving it in place is so not a thing anymore, it's barely even the stuff of legends. Why would Siuan think that's on the list of possibilities? Especially in such an overwhelming and emotionally fraught and literally things are on fire moment?

And all Moiraine says in response (in her defense there are a lot of things going on) is "I can't"

Which, yeah, Siuan knows that is (supposed to be) the case

And THEN, fucking Lanfear shows up, gets pretty easily talked into not killing Moiraine by Rand, and then Moiraine and Lan follow Lanfear and Rand through the waygate without a word

I think it would be 100% reasonable, actually, for Siuan to suspect that Moiraine is a darkfriend after all of that, and given what she knows

So much of Moiraine's life has been out of Siuan's view, for like 20 years now. So much could've happened

And now Moiraine is using the One Power even after she told everyone that she was stilled

Kind of a guilty look actually!!!

(If this is what they're doing though they definitely should've been more clear/explicit/developed with the setup, tho. But otherwise I think it's really interesting as a potential plot point!)

forgiving and needing to be forgiven

Moiraine threatened Lan with a serious violation: she threatened to have Alanna force a bond on him. Lan could have chosen to walk away after that. Instead, he chose to consider this--and the rest of her shitty behavior--in context of Ishamael's assault on her and her own subsequent serious illness. He chose to forgive her - and we see, in the beach scene, that Moiraine makes it clear she doesn't expect his forgiveness.

When they come back together, choosing to open their hearts to each other once more--and emphasis is on Lan's wince as his heart reopens to her; it is his freely made choice, but it has a cost, there are scars left by what they've both been through and how Moiraine has treated him--the magic circles them and it is beautiful. Freely choosing to understand someone you love is hurting and commit to forgiving their mistakes and wrongs is a powerful thing; it is what makes long-term relationships possible. It is a kind of common magic - how people can grow, change, fuck up, and choose each other again and again. It is beautiful.

Loving someone, sharing a life together, and knowing them so well for decades--whether platonically or romantically--is one of the most beautiful things an adult human can choose to do. It is hard work; it is pure joy; it is the cultivation of grace for another and their failings and wrongs and the humility to recognize your own failings and admit your wrongs.

It's understanding and being understood, even the parts of you that aren't pretty, even the parts of them that aren't pretty. It's caring for someone when they're sick--not only temporarily, but even in chronic ways that wear upon you, that motivate the person to be hurtful toward you, like Moiraine was sick in s2--it's experiencing the vulnerability of receiving that kind of care even when you're difficult and unsightly. And every day it is a choice.

Moiraine can choose to forgive Siuan in the same way that Lan chose to forgive her. The same ethics and emotional truths apply and the reasons for Moiraine to choose to do so go back even further, are rooted even deeper, than Lan and her and their platonic love.

Lan forgives Moiraine at this point in the story because their relationship is very important, but it isn't Moraine's big true love romance - Siuan is. Their narrative arc is just gonna be more fireworks and grand imo. Siuan wrongs her at this point in the narrative (and Moraine wronged Siuan by deceiving her for six months!) because their resolution is being reserved for later. It's probably going to come along with another, even higher stakes resolution in the larger conflict, and it is going to be gorgeous.

Rosamund Pike didn't write Sophie Okonedo a passionate personal letter asking Sophie to play her wife--and Sophie didn't agree to that!-- just so it could end this way. That doesn't make "behind the scenes" sense or narrative arc sense.