#antisylki
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this is so real
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before season 2 aired i thought we would never get our original Mobius back. I thought they were going to shove Sylki down our throats. i thought i was going to have to slough through a poorly written, unbearable season of tv just to get little crumbs of Loki and Mobius interacting.
but this. this far surpassed anything i could have hoped for. even if this story hadn’t been Loki’s i would have devoured it. it was clever and well thought out. it was well written with amazing sets and lighting and music. it played up strengths from season 1 that i thought for sure they had long abandoned. like the incredible and compelling setting that is the TVA. and making the cast an ensemble with the already stellar cast they had (and adding the instantly lovable O.B.). Tom was excellent. Owen was phenomenal. and every scene we got with them together was a gift.
the story was crafted with care and forethought and amazing attention to detail. you can’t say that about most big budget studio stories these days. i’m so in awe of everything this season was. it far surpassed season 1 for me and honored the legacy of Loki in a way i never could have dreamed. i honestly think it will go down as one of the most epic seasons of tv ever, for me.
it may have ended bittersweet, but it really didn’t feel like the end of Loki and Mobius’s story to me. it definitely feels like there’s more to tell. and i can’t wait.
#loki#lokius#mobius#tom hiddleston#owen wilson#i wish people could see just how GOOD this season was#it was bittersweet with more bitter than sweet but my GOD#it was a masterpiece#loki season 2#mcu#loki spoilers#loki series#loki laufeyson#mobius m mobius#loki odinson#loki friggason#pretty rambles#anti sylki#antisylki
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THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS
#loki#loki series#loki series negativity#anti sylvie#anti sylki#anti loki x sylvie#antisylki#she hulk#she hulk negativity#she hulk deserved better#marvel#mcu#mcu criticism#disney+#mcu phase 4
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Why Lokius Should Have Been Canon
This is a sort of combo of two metas that didn't quite get point my across. Some parts will be copied directly, but there's a lot of original content. I will discuss the ship between Loki and Mobius, their place in the show, and the MCU at large. My focus for this meta won't be parallels or motifs, because these things border on well-written friendships. But there will be some of that.
Romance in the MCU
There are a lot of straight couples in the MCU. (Almost) Every main hero is in some heterosexual relationship, Loki included.
(That's not all, not remotely).
But in the LGBTQ+ department... uh.. I think it was mentioned that Valkyrie had a girlfriend... uh... America Chavez had a pride pin... and Loki:
One line. Queer experiences are never a focal point of a show/movie the same way heterosexual experiences are. And that needs to change.
Romance In the Show
Wrong, toxic, or unsuccessfu romantic love is a recurring theme in the show.
Sylki
Sylki was an icky relationship right off the bat. They are the same person. I can't find the post at the moment, but someone has pointed out in their post that them being the same person is referenced in every episode in season 1 (edit: here it is), which is when the romance took place. This made their romance uncomfortable for many viewers.
(Some consider Sylki a toxic relationship, but for this post, the topic is too large to handle with the nuance I'd like to handle it with).
When he's drunk, Loki compares love to a dagger, stating that it hurts you, but when you try to find strength in it, it's not real.
youtube
Which is exactly what happens. Sylvie pushes Loki into a portal and they never get back together.
The Love Triangle
In 02×03, Ravonna Renslayer is infatuated with Victor Timely, but he leaves her behind and betrays her when Miss Minutes told him to. One episode later, we discover that they were indeed an item, and established the TVA together. He Who Remains deleted her memories and they never rekindle their love.
Later in the episode, is the best example of "wrong" romance in the show. Miss Minutes, the AI clock, confesses her love to Viktor Timely. He, obviously, freaks out and shuts her off. Nothing ever comes of this.
Brad and Dox
This one is small, but a big indication to romance being a theme. In 02×01, we're shown this:
The gap in the age of the actors is uncomfortable, and a character in universe has this reaction to it. It is never mentioned again.
So what does all of this leave us with? Not much. None of this properly ties to the finale, or anything really. If I were to write the show I would cut a lot of this out, since it serves no purpose. But it does make you keep romance and its shortcomings in mind. The writers want it to be there, in the back of your head.
Loki and Mobius
Finally! I got to talk about them. The two people in question. First things first, who are they, together? They became really supportive, close friends.
Fans even drew parallels to Chaos & Order, which is a very important theme in Loki. But I'm not here to unpack them. These things don't necessarily make them in love. So what does make them in love? I'll present you my evidence, and you ask yourself,
Would it be valid to suggest romantic implications if a man and a women are:
1) Extremely thouchy with each other.
2) Riding on a tandem bike together.
3) Willing to suffer a fate worst than death for another.
4) Falling on each other after that^
5) Literally the Interrupted Declaration of Love trope. (Ex)
6) Being framed in a circle.
7) Waiting & giving permission to attack.
8) Fixing themselvs before seeing the other.
Of course yes. Maybe you think some of these are a strech, but ultimately, people would point out romantic connotations across the board. And I'm here, pointing them out right now. Some scenes between Loki and Mobius have romantic implications.
Conclusion
Loki is a queer protagonist in the MCU, a universe that lacks representation of queer experiences. His show constantlty reminded us of romance, sometimes for seemigly no reason. In the second season, they wrote him and his best friend with romantic implications. And then, nothing. It should not have been nothing. Lokius should have been canon.
#loki series#anti sylki#antisylki#lokius meta#lokius gif#lokius#loki x mobius#mobius x loki#loki laufeyson#loki odinson#loki#loki season 2#loki s2#loki spoilers#loki 2#anti loki series#anti loki show#loki series criticism#loki series critical#loki and mobius#mobius mcu#mobius marvel#mobius m mobius#tom hiddleston#tom hiddelston loki#owen wilson#marvel mcu#mcu loki#lgbt#queer
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Me, dragging myself across the floor toward the Marvel writers, crying and gasping for breath, having completely run out of hope for Loki season 2 being any good: p-please. Black nails. P-please, just j-just… let me have that. Just that o-one thing, please-
#that’s not gonna happen either#but if it did honestly it would redeem the entire show by like 25% in my eyes#it wouldn’t fix the bad writing thing or the s*lvie thing#but it might fix the ugly wardrobe thing 🤷♀️#loki show negativity#loki series negativity#anti loki show#loki#antisylki#anti sylki#anti sylvie
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Marvel should give Jonathan Majors the boot at this point and just make Ravonna a Kang variant. The set up for it is so perfect, in fact, that I almost wonder whether it was done intentionally in s2.
In order to learn to love other people, Loki had to first learn to love himself, and he did that through loving Sylvie, who he sees as a variant of himself. Now, if he had actually fallen in love with Sylvie, that would have been a problem (and I think that's why, on a meta level, their almost kiss created a nexus event) because it would have been tantamount to falling in love with himself and placing himself and his needs above others. He came close because he was learning how to be close for the first time, so he mistook his feelings for Sylvie for something else. But he course corrected in S2. And it was only when he stopped obsessing over Sylvie and started focusing on the issues impacting the people at the TVA, that he really started forming and refining those friendships he holds so dear (Victor, OB, Casey, B-15, and, of course, Mobius). That's why we see him choosing Mobius and the TVA over Sylvie time and time again in s2. And it's why Sylvie remains...perfectly fine when Loki doesn't focus on her (translation: Loki himself remains perfectly fine when he's not obsessing over his own inadequacies). Sylvie thrives, even, in a position where she has a clear function that benefits others around her (translation: Loki is at his best when he has a clear function that benefits a community around him).
(And lets not even go into what it means that Sylvie, Loki's sense of self, is in food service and Mobius is always the one eating. Let's not talk about that, because I'll start screaming).
Anyway, Loki and HWR's are similar characters, but where Loki learns to care about others more than himself, HWR never does. And what better way to illustrate that important difference between Loki and HWR than making HWR's one partner a variant of himself? Ravonna being a female variant of HWR gels with the narrative so well. Much like Loki and Sylvie, one can read HWR's internal motivations and feelings through Ravonna (she wants order but she also very much wants power - she feels like only one person can have choices and she wants that person to be her). Together, Ravonna and HWR achieve greatness, but it's at the expense of fitting in anywhere except with each other (and then, inevitably, not even there). Ravonna being a HWR variant solves the Majors issue in a way that makes sense and is compelling, I think.
#i have...feelings about female characters being used to illuminate male character but hey! Ravonna taking over for majors solves that too#loki series#lokius#anti sylki#antisylki#ravonna renslayer
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I just saw someone call Mobius a Sylki shipper...What?
Lokius shippers might be delusional, but we will never be as delusional as this.
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Just popping on here to say how much I greatly dislike Marvel now. And how much I hate what they’ve done to Loki in his own show.
I’ve seen the trailers for Season 2 and I’m like: ⚠️ NOPE! ⚠️ Season 1 was already a disaster. And now “Sylvie” who was supposed to be a Loki variant ISN’T one anymore, but her own person.
There is also no hope of Sigyn ever appearing. And if she did, I’d honestly dread what they would do to her at this point.
Please just stop Marvel…
#admin post#I dread what more they will make him go through#I don’t wanna be in the marvel fandom anymore thanks#I’ll stick to fanfiction and canon divergence even AUs#anti marvel#anti loki series#anti sylvie#antisylki
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The MCU trying to promote Sylki ship honestly feels like a desperate move at this point as to not admit that no one really cares about the character
Now follow me on this. It seems to me that the actual comics not only couldn't care less about Sylvie as a character. Taking a look at the impact that the MCU has on comics the lack of Syvle is notable. For example Shang Chi has been given the equivalent of the ten rings, his mother has been incorporated in comics, Lyla from moon Knight has been incorporated in comics, Darcy Lewis debuts in scarlet witch comics and there's that whole thing with Kamala being a mutant now. But Sylvie the character who the show revolves around who gets a Funko of the falling in love moment, nothing.
It's not like elements haven't made their way into comic either, they have. They love the alligator he got his own gag comic. And there's that avengers exiles comic with Loki needing to protect the multiverse. But again no Sylvie the character the creators clearly wanted to be a break out star
Like, marvel is pushing the ship but not the character herself. Like most of the teasers and promotions left her out and focused on the TVA. It really seems like they are not interested in her as a character on her own
You're completely right and to add to that, remember when Sophia said they basically improvised the whole Sylvie story during filming? It seems Marvel wasn't really interested in her from the get-go, she's no more than the perfect excuse to get their point across that Loki is a buffoon and inferior to her, but when it comes to really giving her depth and a background they couldn't care less. Hell, in that post-credit scene in Quantumania she was nowhere to be seen, they had Loki and Mobius there.
It's kind of ironic that they wrote her as this woman who tries to run away from anything Loki-related but she so desperately needs to be linked to him otherwise she's completely empty. She keeps the suit, she has the magic, and every time they want to show her somewhere it's with Loki by her side. Some claim this is out of misogyny but like you mentioned earlier, Layla is in the comics and she doesn't need Marc beside her or for him to define her because she's a well-written character with her own personality, story and capabilities.
Even the romance itself only has the purpose of placing Sylvie on a pedestal while throwing Loki under the bus. Her entire existence is based on the fact that she's superior to him: take Loki out of the equation and she's nothing. But this is not misogyny, she was literally written this way!
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Alrightie everyone moment of truth is almost here, an hour to goo and I just wanna make one more voting system for the aftermath cause I wanna stick put an hour and a half after it comes out depending if somethings happen or not. SOOOOO ONE MKRE TIME GUYS THIS IS FOR THOSE WHO HAVE WATCHED THE FINALE BY NOW
Good luck to all our fellow Lokius fans and all those who want Loki to just have friendships instead of romance relationships. It's been a honor clowning with you guys
Don't wish too hard guys and don't expect much from Disney especially with their awful representation of the LGBTQ+ community, I DON'T CARE IF LOKIUS WINS I JUST WANT S^*#%! TO LOSE
#loki#loki critical#loki negativity#loki series critical#loki series negativity#tom hiddleston#antisylki#loki and mobius#lokius
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I'm so tired of constantly seeing Disney/Marvel pushing pro-S*lki bullshit it's fucking despicable.
Like seriously, can you imagine if the genders were reversed and S*lki was instead about a female character fawning over a male character who is constantly insulting her and telling her to shut up? Everyone would be up in arms about how abusive it was and how it was setting a bad example for young girls (and rightfully so). But because it's a female character doing this to a man, suddenly that's ok??? Sylvie is literally never held accountable for anything she does. It doesn't matter how selfish she acts or how badly she treats other people; the narrative always frames her as this pinnacle of perfection who can do no wrong purely because she's a woman. Nothing is ever her fault because she "had a rough past" so apparently that gives her a free pass to be as despicable as humanly possible and everyone will still love her no matter what. Meanwhile Loki treats her and Mobius with respect and kindness even though they have been nothing but awful to him and yet HE'S the one constantly framed as the "evil narcissist." Fucking disgusting.
#i'm so done with this#loki#loki series#loki series negativity#sylvie laufeydottir#anti sylvie#anti sylki#anti loki x sylvie#antisylki#marvel#mcu#disney plus#mcu criticism
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everyone is getting my hopes up but really i’ll just take any scenes with them because their affection for each other comes thru regardless and just please don’t let him kiss her.
#anti sylki#antisylki#lokius#loki#mobius#loki season 2#loki friggason#mobius m mobius#loki series#marvel#mcu#pretty rambles
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I’ve heard so much criticism about how Loki should’ve been the one to kill He Who Remains instead of Sylvie- because he deserved to be the one the free the timeline, because he deserved to represent chaos but instead ended up representing order, because having him side with a dictator was ooc, etc.
But I would just like to point out that it’s established now that HWR wanted them to kill him. That was literally part of his predetermined plan to reincarnate and stay in power. By doing so, Sylvie continued to follow right down the path he paved for her. She wasn’t being a rebellious hero, she was being a pawn.
Loki saw through the manipulation- he immediately smelled something fishy and refused to just mindlessly go along with it. And if Sylvie had listened to him and just took a minute to talk about it, Loki would’ve tried to come up with some other third option. Because that’s what Loki does- thinks outside the box, finds work-arounds, figures out clever ways to rebel against the status quo.
In that scene, Loki was the one refusing to play the part HWR wrote for him, and sylvie was the one being a perfect little cog in the machine. Despite the fact that he was actively being the voice of reason while she was being erratic and reckless… narratively speaking, he was chaos and she was order. It irritates me that people missed that.
#loki series#loki season 2#loki 1x06#loki 1x6#antisylki#anti sylki#anti sylvie#not rly but I don’t feel like arguing with her stans#loki#he who remains#loki meta#loki series meta
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I miss those times back when he really defended Loki.
#antilokiseries#anti loki show#anti loki series#loki series negativity#antilokishow#i'm vibing with og loki#anti sylki#loki series critical#loki series criticism#loki deserved better#lokiseriesnegativity#lokiseriescriticism#anti sylvie#antisylki#anti mobius#anti lokius
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If you could rewrite sylvie to make her a character you liked and a character worthy of Loki's love, what would you do differently?
Good question! Ugh, I supposed starting entirely fresh and from scratch or just swapping her out for Sigyn is off the table? Let's see...
1- Make her anything but another Loki.
The selfcest thing is the only thing worse than Sylvie's actual characterization. Starting off by giving her an entirely different identity. I mean, while I find Thorki and all incest ships to be 'ewww-y', I guess I'd have less of an issue if she was a Thor Variant. Maybe ditching the romance angle and making her an Odin Variant that Loki has to develop his redemption arc through by means of confronting the relationship he had with his adopted father. But no, that'd be deep and interesting.
2- Get rid of her pissy attitude!
God, can she be any less approachable? Honestly, I think if I had the choice of being pruned or going on an adventure with her, I'd chose the former. She's not pleasant or fun, she's too driven by her trauma and selfishness that she doesn't care for her teammates, and she prefers to put down instead of motivate, so there's no reason whatsoever to thrown in your lot with her. Someone like her would be an absolute detriment to The Avengers, so why should she be considered an asset or ally to Loki and Mobius? And why should audiences be expected to sympathize with her?
Also, why do the writers of this show think fans of Loki, who CLEARLY are the target audience of this show (or else it wouldn't literally be called "Loki") would be game for just watching him get his ass kicked and/or demeaned every five minutes? That's like advertising the world's most satisfying James Bond movie, only to kill Bond in the first act and have the rest of the film be about Pussy Galore.
3- Revamp herbackstory to make it less of an eyeroller.
Sylvie had the single most cardboard cut out backstory known to storytelling. Take out her name and actor and you'd have every Meg Ryan and Sandra Bullock character from 1990-2005. In this massive MCU, the writers couldn't come up with ANYTHING better than a girl/woman who has to fend for herself in a cruel, mean world that just doesn't understand her?
Like....anything?
Even half-assing it could develop something better. How about making her a trained assassin that Loki has to de-program? Yeah, it's far from a unique premise, and I'm sure Waldron couldn't do it any better than Winter Soldier did, but it's still better than what we are expected to support here.
4- Recasting the role.
Nothing against Sophie DiMartino, but she and Tom have no romantic chemistry. Even without the bickering and terrible writing, their dynamic would be more suited to an estranged brother and sister at best.
I haven't decided if I'm in the camp of fancasting Zawe alongside Tom in the MCU, especially now that she's been placed elsewhere and her character in The Marvels probably won't ever encounter Loki, but at least we know there'd be legit chemistry between them, and it would be easier to digest the pairing (probably just cute seeing them play off each other on screen too).
If not Zawe, maybe a big character actor that we know can swashbuckle but also be soft and sympathetic, like Keira Knightly or Zhang Ziyi.
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I don't care how or why Sylki ended.
I'm just glad it's over.
It never should have started.
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